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What type of manager do the Orioles need for 2010?

This is not an official poll. The results are haphazard and arguably meaningless.

What did you expect? I mean, it’s not even a real bar. But if you are truly disappointed, then I will return your cover charge.

Anyway, I tallied Wednesday’s comments for and against keeping Orioles manager Dave Trembley for 2010.

It was 32 against him, 25 for him and a bunch that commented around the specific question without giving a definite answer (I’m cool with that, too. We don’t judge at Connolly’s).

The point is it was close. An argument can be made each way.

I guess my contention is that those who criticize Trembley’s in-game moves are missing the big picture. Oftentimes, he is replacing one reliever who shouldn’t be in the majors with another reliever who shouldn’t be in the majors.

He is pinch-hitting a kid who won’t be in the big leagues in two years with a veteran who won’t be in the big leagues in two years.

OK, I’m exaggerating a bit, but the guy doesn’t have enough quality personnel to allow us to properly evaluate his managerial skills on a daily basis. Are there things he has done I disagree with? Absolutely. But are his mistakes so rampant that it proves he can’t manage at this level? Nope.

I keep him for 2010. And one of the reasons is I don’t know who should be his replacement. Or, I should say, what kind of manager should replace him.

Today I don’t want to get into the names of potential replacements. Trembley still has his job, and it would be disrespectful to start clamoring for another candidate.

But I want to know this: What type of manager should lead the Orioles in 2010?

What’s funny is that the Orioles have tried all kinds of prototypes in the past decade: There was the veteran who would force accountability onto the players (Ray Miller), the proven winner (Mike Hargrove), the fresh-faced hot commodity (Lee Mazzilli), the players’ manager (Sam Perlozzo) and the nurturing development guy (Trembley).

How did those work out?

What’s left is the hard-(nosed) disciplinarian -- which is usually a disaster for young teams. No doubt some Orioles could use a good benching when they don’t give 100 percent. But let’s see how that disciplinarian keeps the clubhouse when this team is losing 90 in 2010 and the veteran leaders are grousing about being treated like rookies. (Remember, the 2009 player is much different than the ones Earl Weaver terrorized in 1970.)

Again, I think it is a lot more about the personnel than the manager right now.

But I want to hear what personality type you want in your next manager. And I want to see how that differs from what Trembley brings to the table. Or what Sammy P brought. Or Mazz or Grover or Rabbit.

Daily Think Special: What type of manager do the Orioles need for 2010?

Comments

The kind whose name is Jim Palmer.

But seriously (not that I wasn't being pretty serious there) I want a guy who can instill the desire to win every battle they go into. A guy who will get them to fight. A guy who will light a fire under their butts. Of course, that only comes on the heels of getting them to play fundamentally sound ball.

Also, if it's not too much to ask, someone who will get them to be a bit more patient/selective at the plate. But I think that comes with having someone, a veteran, like that on the team. *cough* Bobby *cough cough* Abreu *cough*

A manager with a personality. Trembley either was born without one, or had it surgically removed. I've covered and/or been around coaches in all four major pro sports, and I can honestly say I've never met anyone so bland, lifeless, dull, uninspiring, depressing, frustrating, inanimate, unimaginative, boring and listless. He brings a whole new meaning to "laid back"; he looks like he should be "laid out" at the funeral parlor. I used to have trouble sleeping, but I would listen to his post-game speeches and be zonked immediately. The guy has no place in any position, in any endeavor, where he has to inspire, motivate and lead. They say teams reflect the personality of their coach. John Harbaugh is a good example. For Trembley... well you get the point. I really liked Davey Johnson as a manager, but he wouldn't be good for this team. He has absolutely no patience and "tact" is not his style; blunt is more like it. He might traumatize the kids and cause the veterans to retire. All this leads me to believe the O's need someone who is energetic, patient and enthusiastic, but who holds his players accountable. Which describes everything Trembley is not.

One who knows what winning at the major league level feels and looks like...bottom line...we need someone who exudes a winning attitude, not someone who is trying not to lose.

Whether he is hard-nosed or takes a softer approach, he needs be able to breed a winning attitude among these players.

If God has some free time he could manage them. Then again, I don't think even God can win with this team

DAVEY JOHNSON has roots here ,DAVEY JOHNSON played in World Seies here,DAVEY JOHNSON has won World series ,DAVEY JOHNSON is the last manager to win anything here. DAVEY JOHNSON WHY NOT? OFFER HIM A 2 year deal with an option !!

What the Orioles really need is new ownership. This ownership clearly isn't willing to spend what it takes to win ball games.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for developing young players and giving them a chance to get regular playing time, but it's as though a top of the line free agent starting pitcher or two and a legitimate cleanup hitter would have blocked anyone, had we signed them in any one of the last few years. Angelos uses rebuilding as an excuse not to expand payroll. And every year the "good prospects" are right around the corner, in AA or something -- I guess they've been in AA since 1998.

More direct to the question -- what we need is a manager who's won before and can instill that winning attitude in players. A guy with tough hardnosed standards for the young guys, but who cuts the veterans some slack and turns around and tells the young guys "Hey, when you win 20 games or hit .300 for a few years like so-and-so, I'll go easier on you, too, because you'll have earned it, but you haven't yet.." is probably the right mix for a good clubhouse. I don't know who that is, but it isn't Dave Trembley.

Trembley wasn't the right guy to be named manager in the first place. When he got his contract while he was an interim in the middle of a lengthy losing streak, I said so at the time, and then later that same night, we lost 30-3. I'm sure he's a nice guy, I'm sure he knows a lot more about baseball than I do, but his record speaks for itself. And, yeah, he doesn't have the players, but, in the end, I don't think he has the mangerial skills either. He might be able to win with the right players, but you can say that about a lot of managers -- we need someone truly special to get the most out of what are never going to be appropriately starstudded teams like the ones in New York and Boston (At least not as long as Angelos owns the team)

If McPhail had had his way year before last. Joe Girardi would have been hired to manage the Orioles. He offered Girardi the job and Girardi declined.
We should remember that.
Trembley was his convenient second choice.
Here's what I think:
Between Rick Dempsey, Don Baylor, Eddie Murray, Mike Flanagan, and Frank Robinson, you make Dempsey manager, Flanagan pitching coach, Baylor teaches baserunning and the outfielders and coaches third base, Murray teaches batting and infielders and coaches first base, and Frank is the bench coach.

Send Trembley and his whole staff packing back to the minors where they belong.

His name is Jim Tracy, well, thats if Colorado does not retain him....whoever they pick, they better let him pick his own staff, I love the Crow, but he ain't my co-worker

Dave Jauss

Dave Trembley is the right man for the job in 2010. If we start putting a quality team on the field and start trading FOR players in July and August instead of trading AWAY players then we'll be able to compete.

Roberts 2B
Markakis RF
??? 3B
??? 1B
Jones CF
Wieters C
Scott DH
Reimold LF
Izturis SS

Fill those two ??? spots and add a closre and a stopper to the pitching staff and then they can compete. To expect Trembley to win without those four key parts is just unrealistic.

What the team lacks is heart, believing in themselves ... and talent. If you have the first two, sometimes you can overcome the third. And that means leadership - on and off the field. In free agency, the Orioles need to look to fill the obviously holes, but also find someone who is a vocal leader. These silent types just haven't worked. And that goes for the managerial position as well. Someone with fire, who has a proven record of working and developing young players. A top level minor league manager who has been passed up by some of the high priced and high level franchises who need a "name" in their particular market. A lunch pail guy, whose not afraid to kick someone in the ass when they need it, or pat them on the back. Casey Stengal, the great Yankees manager of the past, found his success in understanding each of his players and what motiviated them. For some it was that kick in the ass. For others it was that extra pat on the back. Our young players will never develop to their full potential if this team continues to lack leadership, to lack fire. I'm tired of the apologies. Injuries here or there. Whose fault are those? Why are there seemingly more injuries in Baltimore than elsewhere? Is that about preparation and conditioning and discipline and heart and desire.

I want old school. I want a chain smoking (Weaver/Leyland), foul mouthed, hissy fit throwing, base tossing, in your face kind of guy. Does Leyland have a brother?

These young guys need to be on edge a bit and they need to make sure they don't fall into bad habits.

Not just a manager with a desire to win, because 99.99% of managers have that.

No, we need a manager who knows how to win, win consistently, and teach young players how to win.

The kind that comes completely outside of the organization. The kind that knows how to manage a winner. The kind that knows how to handle a clubhouse of players with varying salaries, starpower, personalities, and cultures. Perhaps one who has won a pennant. Only one name out there fits this criterion and has the credentials to turn the O's around: BOBBY VALENTINE.

He's a winner, he's got a strong personality, he knows how to keep it loose in the clubhouse, but also how to maintain order. It's a slam dunk.

Help me out here...what nurturing has Trembley accomplished here in birdland?

If you are a parent you understand "tough love." How's the kid turn out if you don't discipline at a younger age, but try to later on after he has developed bad habits?

This team is a reflection of their manager and coaches - minor leaguers.

When a player doesn't run out ground balls you sit him down. When he doesn't know how many outs there are you sit him down. When he runs into an infielder, fielding the ball, and gets called out you sit him down. When a runner stands still between bases, waiting for a bus, you sit him down.

And when a manager displays no penchant to inact discipline you sit him down.

We need a butt-kicking professional manager. Earl Weaver kicked their butts in the minors and majors. Go ahead and check out how many pennants Earl won in the minors and the majors with his style.

This team will lose 100 games this year. They already have the distinction of the majors' longest losing streak and the majors worst team era.

So tell me...how's all that nurturing working out for the Orioles so far?


A manager who expects to win no matter what. No excuses! Anyone could have said the Orioles in 1989 should be a last place team, but Frank Robinson got that team to believe in themselves against the odds and have a great season. I believe on paper that team was worse than this years Orioles. I am holding out hope that Ozzie Guillen will be let go after the season. He is the type of manager the Orioles need. Someone who does not accept losing no matter what the circumstance is.

What about Eric Wedge? In his early years with the Indians, he took a very young and talented club to the playoffs. He is well-spoken of throughout baseball. His undoing had more to do with getting rid of All-Star caliber players rather than his own managerial failures. I'd be interested to hear other thoughts.

I believe Hargrove and Miller would be better choices NOW then they were back when they were hired. And I felt our team was the most exciting it had been in years when Mazzilli was manager, but he rubbed Angelos (and O's fans) the wrong way with his Yankee attitude and out spokeness (O’s to National League ?!).

We need a manager like Mazzilli was, but he has to have the Orioles background.
A name I had heard bounced around, found curious at first but grew more fond of after thinking about it, is Billy Ripken. He is a young, firey guy who knows the Orioles way and the Ripken way, and he always seemed to have good instincts while he played the game.

I just can’t agree there are not better options then Trembley. He has lost at every level he has ever coached at! The talent he has now isn’t great, but can we really say that about EVERY team he has ever coached? He has never won in his entire baseball career. It’s time to let Trembley go and lose somewhere else. It’s time to bring in either a fresh face (Ripken) or a veteran winner (Valentine, Hargrove, Showalter, Davey Johnson, etc…)

If it is not going to be Trembley (and frankly any manager next year is likely to be facing another losing season) then lets bring in someone who respects the traditions of the Orioles Way but brings new ideas for managing players and winning games.

The blOriOles need a manager who can pitch nine innings every day with an ERA under 4.

someone with a pulse. someone who has a winning background. someone who has a little fire in them. someone who knows how to use the pitching staff. someone who is flexible

Are you serious? did you call Trembley a nurturing development guy? This guy couldn't develop a rash let alone a decent baseball player!!! He was a career minor league manager for a reason...cause he stinks!! No one else would give him a shot after 20 years that should have said something about his skills or lack there of. Don't let the door hit you on the a$$ on the way out Trembles!!!

The Orioles need a manager who has won on the Major League level. That's a big problem with this mess. Even the veteran players on this team have never won.

It needs to be someone who has won as a manager and not as a 3rd base coach like Lee Whatshisname who piggybacked on some Yankee World Series winners.

They need the strong independent manager that Angelos will not permit.
Davey Johnson comes to mind, a manager that Angelos ran off with a sham excuse. Until Ripken owns this team the winning tradition is a distant memory

Peter Angelos don't care if the teams winning or losing or about the fans, he's just interested in making the almighty dollar.

Never should have gotten rid of Davey Johnson.

needs;
good managing instinct
proven winner
even handed and yet tough...

...hey Andy, go wake up Tom Kelly, sell him our bill of goods, and tell Pete to PAY him....

There is something to be said for the morose vibe you get from the club each year. I guess losing the most games in the league can do that. But, for playing a kid's game, there sure is a lack of fun and humor with this club. Just sleepwalking through something that you would think should bring quite a few smiles. The whole club seems so stressed out all the time. Maybe a manager who can bring a little perspective and life to things. Just a thought.

One that can manage and come out of the dugout to pitch in relief!

Seroously though, coming up through the minor leagues as a coach, then manager is pretty normal. It is the stepping stone in your coaching career. Trembley coached High School, College, Minors, then Major League coach and finally manager. What do you want?

If they change, get back one of the guys that experienced the winning tradition this club had long ago, problem is that most of those guys are retired now. The ones from the 96 and 97 seasons were short term here in Baltimore except Ripken.

Someone who has Earl Weaver's mentality for offenive strategy. Someone who values on base percentage and power hitting while eschewing small ball elements such as bunting and stealing bases.

What the O's need is the next Hank Bauer. I think Trembly has had a real tough job, given the injuries, trades etc. That said, I was all for keeping him until the last few weeks. He has lost control, just like Billy Hitchcock. We need something new. I am tired of the Manager-go-round of the last dozen years, but the results are so stark this Sept. we NEED a change. Someone like Leo Derocher, who can coach and nurture the young guys while jumping on the seasoned guys when the screw up. Have we ever had such bad baserunning? Did our 3rd base coach go to sleep or just make a slew of bad decisions? Everyone is taking advantage of the O's these days, we need a Manager who can protect them and yes, get thrown out once in awhile.

By all means, bring Davey Johnson back.

I don't mean to be cliche', but if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Unfortunately, we've been trying super glue for the last dozen years.

I'd like to see a manager who is a fusion of Bobby Valentine and Davey Johnson....hard nosed, instructors who dont accept less than a winning attitude from anyone including the front office. That's why we wont see either of them!

Bobby Valentine - Any chance?

---

Barkeep's Reply: A chance? Sure. A marriage? I dunno. I talked to Valentine several months ago and he said he'd love to manage in the states again, so I can't imagine his new ESPN deal trumps those feelings. But Bobby's not one to hold his tongue, and I am not sure that fits with Andy MacPhail's buttoned-down professionalism. It'd be an interesting match.

Billy Ripken is a GREAT IDEA!!!! I never even thought of him. He would be perfect! I hope he gets a shot and maybe we should start and grassroots effort to get his name in there.

I'd say stick with Trembley since he's been around young players his whole professional life, so he knows how to handle them. Sitting them to make a point about how they screwed up is a good idea, however, who are you going to replace them with for that game or two? It's not like the backup/bench options are that numerous.

If you have to pick a type other than Trembley to manage next year, how about seeing if MacPhail could lure Tom Kelly out of retirement? Kelly won the two world championships for Minnesota when MacPhail was GM there, and that team was a lot of young guys who grew up w/Kelly as manager. He's firey and can be intense, but also has a teacher's way about him too.

Cal Ripken - Manager
Mike Mussina - Pitching Coach
Brooks Robinson - Bench Coach

I love a good bar discussion like this. It's amazing how many different takes there are on it. And a lot of good thoughts from different angles. I'm not sure what is needed, but one thing I believe - it won't be one of our old heroes from the Earl Weaver era. No Dempsey, Flanagan, Murray, or Robinson.

F-Robby is the only one of those four with experience managing at the ML level, and he paid his dues managing in winter ball before getting his fist stint in the majors. And I love Frank, but he has a career winning percentage of .475, with losing records for each of the four clubs he managed. Yes, he had at least one winning year with each club but ended with a losing overall record for each. Amazing how having crappy players can translate to losing records for the manager.

Why does it have to be someone with ML managerial experience? Earl did not have it.

We say we want a "proven winner" who has successfully managed in the majors. We should be saying we want a guy who has won consistently, even when the other teams have better players, a guy who can make chicken salad out of chicken [stuff]. Because unless about a half dozen unlikely things all happen for the good, the Orioles should be notably improved next year but still significantly outmanned.

Good luck to whoever it is.

Ryne Sandberg. Relatively young (unlike Davey Johnson, Bobby Valentine, Tom Kelly and other names tossed around here). Three years of minor league managing experience in the Cubs system (not much, but more than Bill Ripken has). A Hall of Famer the young players could respect for his accomplishments at the major league level. Give him a veteran bench coach and fill out the rest of the staff with young energetic coaches who have managed or instructed at the minor league level (no more Terry Crowleys, please). Let the young team grow with a young, fresh manager and coaching staff.

Bring in somebody with ties to the organization, somebody who knows the "Oriole Way" -- the way it USED to be.

Now, Palmer's enjoying his announcer gig too much, I imagine; Brooks and Franks probably wouldn't have any interest; and Cal's biding his time until he can outright buy the team from Angelos.

But maybe someone like a Brady Anderson, Doug DeCinces, Mike Deveraux, Eddie Murray, Chris Hoiles, ANYBODY who can teach this young group what it means to be an Oriole. If they're proud of the organization they work for, they'll produce better -- same as in any job.

I think that the orioles could keep trembley for another year, but what happens when they develop enough talent to win. then they not only have guys who have never been there before, but also a manager that has never been there before. I think they need a guy like Bobby Valentine or Buck Showalter once they get good enough, if they get good enough

rod carew - hitting coach

jim palmer - pitching coach

eddie murray - bench manager

manager - don baylor or
someone previously in the
oriole organization 1982 or prior........

The O's need a Brian Billick type manager. That was got the Ravens on track - a kick the door down, where the 'heck' is he - kind of guy. An ego the size of the Chesapeake and a colorful vocabulary could help too.

We could turn the whole thing around with one signing. Name Babe Ruth player manager. He can bat cleanup and pitch once every four days plus increase concession income from sale of hot dogs. Of course there is that whole issue of his being dead to overcome.

One that can figure out how to win in Baltimore again!

I keep thinking about Rick Dempsey as a manager...just have a feeling he might have the right mix of attributes and background to do the job.

He does not have any experience...which is a big downside...but if people think Palmer could do something, then I think you give Rick a look.

At the least, I think he could bring some fun back to the clubhouse and still instill some discipline.

This is just a gut feeling...wish I could back it up with more substance.

Hey Pete, My largest problem I have with the O's is...they STINK! Ok, we can keep saying to ourselves that they are a young (but talented) bunch of players and that they will only get better 'in time'. How much time does a fan have to wait? Seems like after Cal retired, so did any prospect of ever making the playoffs (EVER). Wierd, since Cal's numbers were not that big at the end of his career - but we at least had a group of players that were 'competitive'. They can't even reach .500 for the season! Granted, in our division we have 2-3 teams that are at the tops as far as power goes (Tampa Bay is a stretch this year), it is extremely hard to win against - but where is the no-how of our 'talented' group to fight late in the year? I mean C'mon! How many years have we had losing seasons since our last playoff berth? And to top it off...100 losses? I guess We'll see, won't we?

In our world of pro sports, it seems to be common place to fire the guy in charge when you have had an embarrasing season for your city...but what is 'embarrassing' anymore? Sure, fire Dave...but he can only manage the guys he has - and that is not much. I say that he should get fired - but MacPhail should be warned as well...change course in the next year or you are next! With that said, doing better than 100 losses should be an easy thing to do as far as job security is concerned.

Pete, my question to you is...if we fire Dave, who do we go after for the job? I doubt we could lure any big names with the team that is here now. That also goes for players we can get to sign here as well (in my opinion).

If we can't bring back Earl Weaver, bring back Davey Johnson. Then give him talent he can work with. What ever happened to "The Oriole Way" ??

The manager is the most overrated spot on a ML roster. I don't care who it is, it's the players who need to be held accountible. What are we going to say if we get a new manager and they still 90 games? "Uh, well, at least we didn't lose 100".

IMO, the Orioles need the type of manager who will:

1) PLAY TO WIN! Not play to "not lose"

2) Not accept medicore play and/or poor fundamentals.

3) Know how to handle a pitching staff.

4) Not be afraid to sit/call players out if not performing up to expectations

If the team can find a manager with the above characteristics, then I think we can see actual improvement. This team has been noticeably worse under Trembley and it shows.

We need a Ron Gardenheir type manager. Earlier in the year one of his guys didn't run out a grounder and he sat him on the bench and sent him to AAA the next day. There isn't one guy on that team that doesn't hustle on every play.

Well, if you have to get rid of Trembley, then either bring Davey Johnson back (remember '97 - wire to wire), Jim Palmer for pitching coach, and Brooks Robinson for Bench coach. Sounds like a win-win deal to me with the manager, and coaches all world series Oriole winners or played together and worked together. Peter, now SHOW THEM THE MONEY.

Baltimore Fan that wants to be here.

Judges players by what they do not who they are.

Smart managerial style that puts players where they should be.

Untested choice so we don't just pick up someone that another team fired.

Retired former catcher that knows how pitchers think.

Hard nosed player that expects the same from his players.

Old school ideals.

Former All Star player knows what it takes to win.

Former Oriole is the most important because then he will know how important winning is to this city.

Whats that spell?

B
J

S
U
R
H
O
F
F

Woo!

How about a John Harbaugh type in the form of a baseball player or coach. Seriously, he is young, has a very quiet confidence (almost a swaggar), is very demanding and no non-sense. He also seems to know how to run a team. Not sure who out there who fits the bill but that is what we need.

Hey Dan....You are doing a great job .....keep up the good work.

Couple of things.....first of all. Is this season over yet????? It is so painful to watch i just cant imagine being a player. It is the stuff of nightmares.

Dave Trembley.....i am not a big supported of Dave's, but the longer this season goes on the more i feel his pain.
This cannot be good for his health, his psyche, of his well being. No player or manager deserves this kind of abuse.

As far as the next manager is concerned i think we are looking a Rick Dempsey. Personally i think x catchers make excellent managers. Mike Scioscia, Joe Torre, Joe Girradi, Bruce Bochy, Bob Melvin, Jim Leyland, Joe Maddon, Ned Yost.......and i know someone will say, "Eric Wedge just got canned from Cleveland, and he is an x catcher".
Thats true, but my catcher rule is not 100% fool proof.
Even Johnny Oates had a better then .500 winning % when he managed the Orioles for 3.5 years!!!
Why do catchers make good managers? Catchers probably make good managers because catchers are like generals on the field. The catcher is the only player besides the pitcher that is a part of every play, and most pitchers aren't going to be playing the whole game while catchers often do. A catcher has to know every player's strengths and weaknesses and that ability to have a lot of knowledge carries on with them.

So Dan, thats my two cents for today.....thanks for letting me vent.

IT'S OBVIOUSLY NOT THE MANAGER WE HAVE GONE THROUGH A DOZEN OF THEM. IT'S THE PLAYERS THEMSELVES THEY NEED TO PLAY HARD EVERY GAME GIVE THE FANS WHAT THEY DESERVE IN WITCH AT LEAST IS A HARD DAYS WORK EACH DAY THEY TAKE THE FIELD. THE O'S HAVE NO PASSION THEY HAVE NO FIGHT IN THEM THEY MAKE MILLIONS TO PLAY THE GAME. AT LEAST SHOW SOME BALTIMORE PRIDE. NOW IF WE HET THE FIRST PICK HOPEFULLY THEY WILL DRAFT BRYCE HARPER THE PHENOM FROM LAS VEGAS

Honestly, does it really matter. From top to bottom this is presently the worst run sports franchise..... What a shame from a once proud franchise.

A Billy Martin type.

Hargrove can manage this team. He was great hitter he has managed a winner. Angelos got along with him.

They need someone who can judge talent and has the status and guts to tell McPhail and the rest of the front office which players have no business being on this team. This is the major failing of the O's organization - no one who can judge talent. I will also say who the manager should not be: Palmer, Dempsey, Flanagan, Ripken.

Dan--When you said "what type" my mind moved to the quip-- one where you don't type the name Dave Trembley.

I have real exhaustion now over this as I think some of my friends do here who write to your blog, Pete's, and Roch's.

We're going over the same ground.

If you have not seen Dave T's limitations as a manager by now--all those things apart from injuries and trades of veterans for future possibilities--I don't know how I can convince you that Dave T is not what the Baltimore Orioles want now as their manager.

I want a leader who manages with a visceral desire to win in the dugout every day. I am sick of the posing, the tilt of the head, the sign of infinite patience...or God knows what that look is supposed to convey. (Dave T started out as Captain Kirk but ended up not so boldly going where so many so many men have gone before.)

I am tired of seeing a hot hitter not appearing in the lineup the next day because apparently he was not scheduled to play. And when was this schedule made? In spring training?

I want a manager who has the guts to make a move because he thinks it gives the Orioles the best chance to win today. Not making moves because they will be easy to explain in the post game interviews--should anyone there even bother to ask him about those moves.

I want a manager who can lead. One who the Baltimore Oriole players each day in the dugout know is driving this team to do every thing it can to win tonight's ballgame.

The crazy hit and runs called earlier in the season which led to Aubrey Huff being gunned down at second 5 times.

The failure to bunt when it gave the team a chance to get a guy down to second with one out in a tie game.

The inept handling of the pitching staff all season.

In short, Dave T is locked into schedules and plans. He is not a leader with baseball instincts. He has been a committed man to the organization and he deserves respect for that. But Dave T is not a good Major League manager. He cannot improvise.

When he lost his cool this season, he publicly called out Felix Pie. That was not right. Pie had been struggling but he had been busting his butt all along. All this did was contribute to scapegoating of a guy during down times for the team. Pie deserves credit for bouncing back.

Who would I like to be the manager of the Baltimore Orioles in 2010? Davey Johnson would be a good choice. Bringing him back would signal to Oriole fans that Peter Angelos understands that things fell apart after Davey left. This guy is our original #15 (Matt Wieters could go back to his college days and minor league #32). Davey's return would be a fascinating story. He is a gifted manager.

My next choice? Buck Showalter. Watching and listening to Buck on ESPN over the past year has made me enamored with his drive and quirky baseball mind. Buck wants to win. He would be fun.

Finally, if Tom Kelly would like to rejoin Andy MacPhail and bring a young Oriole team to contention, that would not be bad at all. Kelly is a sound, attentive manager.

Dave Trembley is a decent human being, but he's not a good manager. Even his defenders admit that, either explicitly or implicitly, arguing that he should be kept on for other reasons--"we need stability, we've got to be fair (he was dealt a rotten hand, injuries, trades, etc.), the losing isn't his fault, and anyway we won't be able to get anyone better." None of these are valid arguments. He's had the team for long enough to show whether he can manage well or not, some of the losing IS his fault (in my view his ineptitude, and that of his coaches, have cost the team 10-15 games), and there's no reason to think that a good, experienced, successful manager can't be persuaded to come here. The Orioles need a major professional in this vital spot, the fans need one, the city needs one. Trembley and his entire coaching staff should be released, both on their merits--or, more accurately, lack of merits--and so that the new manager can have a free hand in selecting his own team.

I think that the new man, and his coaches, should all come from outside the Orioles system. We need fresh talent, fresh standards, fresh ways of doing things--and not doing things. "The Orioles way" might have stood for something once, but it doesn't anymore. The team needs tougher and more demanding standards throughout
the system, the capstone and the touchstone of which should be the major league club. Right now, if anything, the reverse is true.

Great former players don't usually make good managers, just as great actors don't usually make good directors. The skill sets are different, the temperaments are different, and the goals are different. What the Orioles need now is something the team hasn't had since Davey Johnson--a professional manager.

Whoever the new pick may be, he should be someone who has had success elsewhere, someone with an independent name and stature. This will give him a necessary authority in his dealings with the owner and the GM, an authority that Trembley and his immediate predecessors never had. The result may create more tension within
team management, but that would be a healthy and necessary thing--out of it would come, in general, a refusal to accept mediocrity, and in particular, smarter decisions on player trades, acquisitions, promotions, and releases. One of the great weaknesses within the Orioles organization has been the unwillingness, perhaps even the inability, of the owner to tolerate having such people of independent stature around him. If that doesn't change, this team is doomed.

I think the most important decision now facing the owner and the GM is the choice of the new manager. If that's done right, everything else will fall into place. If it's not, we'll all muddle along as we have over the past 12 years, bottom feeders forever--and the
laughing stock of the sports world.


I second the suggestion of drafting Jim Palmer. You'd improve the pitching immediately. He is intelligent, analytical, he knows baseball. He is an Oriole, a Hall of Famer, and his post-game news conference would be something you could listen to with pleasure.

The ownership needs replaced which is not even in the equation. Replacing managers is not the answer; replacing managers and retaining coaches is not the answer

I say Larry Bowa but the bottom line is the team is going to have to spend some money on a coach so don't expect any hi name coaches to come. I also think that whoever they bring in should be able to hire there own coaching staff as well. But i do think they need a coach with some spark, enthusiasm, and has the nack for putting players in when they need to be put in and or taken out. (NO PITCH COUNT). I wouldn't mind seeing rick dempsey either!

They need a manager with a relentless desire to win who can build a team that plays better collectively than the sum of its individual parts. For some reason, Trembley's teams make you scratch your head and ask, "Why can't this team win more games.". They also need a manager who communicates better with Hispanic players; Trembley has had too many issues with them since he got here. I don't know if the manager they need is available, and I don't think that Trembley can be blamed for this squad having a losing record, but I do think that to renew his contract for one year would be simply delaying the inevitable.

Let me buy a drink for the person who suggested BJ Surhoff....I love that idea. Talk about passion for the game, a local guy, a former catcher. I really liek that suggestion.

Q. What type of manager do the Orioles need for 2010?

A. The opposite of Dave Trembley

DAVEY JOHNSON IS THE MAN ! BRING HIM BACK!

What if the O's had had the imaginary PERFECT manager this year? What if LaRussa had managed this team, or Davey Johnson, or Stengel, or whatever dream manger you can name. How many games could the best manager in the history of the game have won with this rotation, this bullpen, this lineup, and this bench? What could a great manager have gotten out of Rich Hill, Aubrey Huff, and company? If anyone believes we'd be a legitimate major-league team if only we had the right manager, I'd be amused to hear your reasoning.

D
A
V
E
Y
J
O
H
N
S
O
N

Managerial records
Team Year Regular Season Post Season
Won Lost Win % Finish Won Lost Win % Result
NYM 1984 90 72 .556 2nd in NL East - - - -
NYM 1985 98 64 .605 2nd in NL East - - - -
NYM 1986 108 54 .667 1st in NL East 8 5 .615 Won World Series over BOS
NYM 1987 92 70 .568 2nd in NL East - - - -
NYM 1988 100 60 .526 1st in NL East 3 4 .429 Lost NLCS to LA
NYM 1989 87 75 .537 2nd in NL East - - - -
NYM 1990 20 22 .476 2nd in NL East - - - (fired)
CIN 1993 53 65 .449 5th in NL West - - - -
CIN 1994 66 48 .579 1st in NL Central - - - No Playoffs
CIN 1995 85 59 .590 1st in NL Central 3 4 .429 Lost NLCS to ATL
BAL 1996 84 78 .543 2nd in AL East 4 5 .444 Lost ALCS to NYY
BAL 1997 98 64 .605 1st in AL East 5 5 .500 Lost ALCS to CLE
LA 1999 77 85 .475 3rd in NL West - - - -
LA 2000 86 76 .531 2nd in NL West - - - -
Total 1148 888 .564

Dan,
You hit all points right on the head. Even if we knew who'd be perfect for the managerial job, what makes anybody think that he'd take the job? If we could trick a different man into taking the job, he should be a tireless, former player, 39-42 yrs old, with exceptional communicative & motivational skills, to completely change how Os players prepare over the winter.j

It doesn't really matter who the manager is until we get better players.
Dave Johnson was fired after winning 98 games in 1997. Since then Ray Mller averaged 78 wins in 2 seasons, Mile Hargrove averaged 69 wins in 4 seasons, Mazzilli won 78 in his 1 full season, Perlozzo won 70 in his 1 full season and now Trembly is trying to win with this sorry bunch.

MISCONCEPTION:
The Os need more than a clean up hitter in the line up. Why do people keep writing that they need a clean up hitter ? This team needs, minimum,...a 4,5,& 6 hitter, at the 1B,3B,& (DH or SS) positions, just to start to compete for 4th or 3rd place.

One word.

Winner!

My biggest pet peeve is posters like "ALWAYS AN O'S FAN" who post without fact or basis. He says Trembley has lost at every level..WRONG!! He won two minor league championships, and lost in the finals twice. He was also Baseball America Minor League Manager of the Year once also. Too many idiots post anything they want on here just to see their words in print!!

i like the idea of adding both Billy Ripken and BJ, maybe one as managerand one as third base coach.

A manager who knows the ins and outs of baseball.

A manager who knows his pitching staff and gives his starters ownership of the game, 'it's yours to win, or lose.'

A manager with a MAJOR LEAGUE mentality unlike the current mgr the Orioles have.

A manager who won't put up with all the crap seen on the field like lousy base running, errors, etc.

It's not Dave Trembley's fault... PERIOD!

He didn't trade All Star closer, Sherrill... Did he?

He didn't trade clean-up hitter, Huff... Did he?

He didn't intend for Uhara, Jones, Reimold, Pei to go down injured... Did he?

He didn't intend on Johnson, Baez to suck after Sherrill left... Did he?

If McPhail decides to bring in another manager, he needs to be ready to explain his reasons for doing so..:

He needs to state that, "this new manager is the guy for lading the team for these reasons.... (and list them)"

He needs to state that, "this new manager is a better fit than Trembley because.... (give some reasons)"

He needs to tell all of Baltimore that "this new manager is the guy we are going to stick with from here on out, thru thick and thin...

If McPhail can't to this then why change managers?

McPhail has made good judgement calls so far and I'm sure he will on this as well. I'm OK for changing managers as long as there is good reason...

Anything else will indicate that the O's will be spinning their wheels for awhile longer. A new manager needs to come in and learn the O's system, players, front office, etc. Is it worth all this? Plus he has to have major league talent to make a lineup from...

Keep Trembley unless there is good reason and explain what it is....

May the O's gel next year... Whoever the manager will be!!

Dan, for me the issue is not that he poor timing in relief swaps (vs. poor material to work with). No, the issue I have with him - and it won't change because this is purely about managerial training - is his absolute allegiance to L-R matchups and that you have to bring someone in to close and use 3 relievers. He has shown this is his pitcher usage philosophy.

Weaver disproved that way before LaRussa (who has almost always had decent, if not superior talent to work with) made so popular the matchup philosophy.

The tried and tested way to win is go with your best relievers, and not stick to some ridiculous formula for bullpen usage and when to pull your starter. So for me, Trembley is a poor manager and needs to go. His strategy with pitching is poor.

It has nothing to do with the fact he has to trot out garbage to replace garbage.

I keep hearing Davey Johnson, but I don't think Davey ever wants to work for Angelos again. I like the idea of B.J. Surroft thought. I think the situation is similar with Joe Girardi and the 2006 Marlins. I think Surroft will have better resources in Baltimore and a better owner ( not good but better)

What we really need to see is a manager with some sense of stability. Burning through 5 pitchers in one game is not the way to go. While we're at it, let's stop grabbing EVERYBODY from the minors. Again, stabilize the roster. Pick a team, develop them, stick with them. Last minute roster changes, trades that give away talent, and the defeatist "keep our heads above water" attitude are the things killing the team. Stability will increase communication, develop a better sense of teamwork on the field, and reduce drama in the clubhouse.
In short, we need a manager who will stop screwing with the roster every week and develop the team he has.

Trembley deserves to be back in 2010, period.

Torre, Francona, Leyland, or LaRussa couldn't have won 80 games with the number of "rookie starts" the O's had this season, and add in a leaky bullpen.

Why can't they find a manager who just has a gut feel for basic baseball? These new age managers have no feel for the game and base most if not all of their decisions on pitch counts or left/right supposed advantage. You can bring any guy off the street, it doesn't matter who, and the results will be about the same.
No manager would have the 2009 Orioles in contention. But someone for a basic feel for the game could have won 10-15 more games. Trembley either did not recognize...or did not want to believe..that he had an inconsistent bullpen. He constantly went to that bullpen too soon. And then, realizing that there was a good likelihood that "someone" in the pen would stink on any given day...he set out to find that guy. Matt Albers strikes out the side in the 6th? He must have it going on today. Lets pull him and see what Baez can do...

bob brenly

I kind of think we should be looking for the hard-nosed disciplinarian type. But, let me clarify. Not the kind of guy who criticizes players on every detail, but a hard nosed guy who lets them play, like a Mike Scoscia, Jim Leyland or (across the parking lot)...John Harbaugh.

Dave Trembley for another year! GOOD!!! HAHA...let all the whiners keep on whining....

Dave Trembley. Oh yeah, their manager next season WILL be Dave Trembley. Heh. Guess I was right.

Did Trembley trade away Huff or Sherrill? Nope. But the O's were in last place with both of those guys.

He kept pitching Berken. He did not have any other choice? Why do you say that? I am pretty sure there were other possible starters out there. Chris Waters, Brian Bass, Mark Hendrickson, Jake Arietta and Troy Patton to name a few. Sure they might have gotten rocked. But its not like Berken was lighting it up.

Pitching Ray and Albers in close ball games. Yeah both struggled in the majors all year. Why put them in close games? To get their confidence up? Aren't you trying to win games? Thery are getting paid to win right?

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