"they're actually rebuilding properly rather than burning money in a futile bid for 80 wins."

That's pretty much the consensus view around baseball. One day some of the posters on here having a hard time getting it will too.

Why all the man-love for Brian Cashman?

This line, in particular is just plain stupid: "...the Yankees have spent their money wisely, signing studs like CC Sabathia rather than sure bets for decline..."

One example. Nice. Oh, and that one example will be getting paid north of $24M per year until he's 34. And he's a pitcher. And he's thrown eight thousand innings over the past three years.

And let's forget about A.J. Burnett. Ya, there's no way he's anything close to a sure bet to decline. 32-year-olds with long injury histories are always safe bets.

Oh, and let's also forget that the Yanks will be paying A-Rod through his 42-year-old season. And they're probably going to do the same thing with Jeter. And they'll probably keep paying Mo Rivera if he wants to keep playing.

And that Posada extension was a great plan, because we all know that 38 and 39-year-old catchers are always worth at least $13M per.

The Yankees are going to be a disaster in three or four years for two reasons. One: Because Brian Cashman is in love with his old veterans. Two: Because of the fact that they're the only team with the ability to toss out ridiculously long deals to guys who will be in their late 30's or early 40's in the final years of the contract.

I'd love to see Cashman move to any other team. That would be the true measure of his skill as a GM. As long as he's with the Yankees, he's just the rich kid with the ability to do anything he wants.

BINGO, not brooks!!! And you didn't even mention that, with the highest payroll in MLB and a blank check to buy ANY free agent he wants, the brilliant Cashman has only built a World Series winner ONCE in the last NINE YEARS!!! He's horrible!!!

not brooks

Good post. Agree with you. One point in Cashman's favor though is their pitching staff. A lot of home growns after you get past CC and Burnett.

Your forgetting Vasquez too freeman. That makes 3/5 of the rotation high priced FA aquisitions. I'd be amazed if you could find another team with $30 million per tied in FA starting pitchers, let alone $50 million.

I agree with previous posts. A monkey could do Cashman's job with the resources he has at his disposal and probably have more than one ring in the past decade to show for it.

What was that great quote Bisciotti gave out last month? ""If I'm a Yankees fan, I'm upset we're not winning 130 games with the roster that they have and the money that they pay out. I think it's a disgrace they only beat the average team by 10 games in the standings with three times the money. I'd fire that GM. You don't need a GM. All you have to do is buy the last Cy Young Award winner every year."

SI would have been well-advised to consider that comment...

Not Brooks,

Do you think the Yankees are going to run out of money in three or four years? I have seen your prediction made by other people starting 15 years ago. I would love it if you are correct because that would mean that I wouldn't have to turn over my ballpark to those obnoxious blow hard fans. My gut feel is that they will still be spending and getting ready to come after Nick Markakis and any other top talent whose signing, growth and development was paid for by another team.

Anybody and I mean anybody can do Cashman's job. Just cherry pick the hottest and most coveted and expensive FAs every year by blowing other teams out of the bidding with insane contracts that you can easily eat when FAs bust (Pavano) and win one championship a decade. Yeah, Steinbrenner's gofer is a real wizard.

Too bad Freidman, Epstein and Cashman were 1,2,3 respectively

This team would be very interesting (and competitive) with a legit #1 SP and clean-up hitter. Thx again, andy

I would actually share the apologists optimism about the upcoming season, instead Im pissed off at another season with no chance of the postseason. a friggin disgrace. Still, ppl defend this shameless travesty

I get frustrated that everyone looks just at the Rays ML payroll to decide they built their club the "right" way. We overlook the ridiculous signing bonuses the dolled out to draft picks over the years, including players who wouldn't sign with other clubs. When you consider their history of rookie signing bonuses, including those who never saw the majors, they hav spent just as much money as anyone.

Gil -

I don't think the Yanks will ever run out of money, but imagine if in, let's say in 2013, CC misses the year with Tommy John surgery, 37-year-old A-Rod hits .270/20/80 and 39-year-old Jeter hits .250/5/40 and doesn't steal any bases?

Running out of money isn't going to be a problem for the Yanks. It's spending that money on 35-year-olds (and up) and long term contracts for pitchers that's going to be their downfall.

Josh -

When you can't compete with other teams on the FA market, you pay your draft picks over slot bonuses to get them to sign with your team.

And to suggest that the Rays signing bonuses have amounted to the team spending "just as much money as anyone" is just plain ridiculous.

Who are you so bitter about anyway? Wade Townsend? He's 26 and he's got a 5.58 Minor League ERA in 43 starts.

That's pretty funny. Epstein and Cashman are second and third, respectively, for spending money and MacPhail is 12th for not spending money.

The message: Why spend some money if you're not going to spend real money?

I'm tired of hearing any kudos for the AL West. They have four freaking teams and hide out playing against each other.

Maybe the AL can adopt seven two-team divisions. That way the worst team (that's us by the way) might some day find someone they beat.

I do have to wonder how headache-inducing our owner still is. Somehow, I think he hasn't lost his touch. If so, evaluating MacPhail is like evaluating the safety of a Toyota without its keys.

Not Brooks,

If that happens it would be Miller Time! I think CC is going to eat himself out of baseball before then anyway. And maybe Jeter's signature hit, the handle hit blooper that lands just inside the right field foul line 10 feet over the first baseman's head...will be a bleeder right to the bag.

Gil, I agree with you, to a certain extent.

You mention Markakis. Take the Orioles. If the plan works out, in three years the Orioles will be more than just a winning team, they could be favorites. All the young guys coming up now, and I know you feel that most won't pan out, but many will, will be 24, 25, 26. Markakis will be 31 at the end of his deal and if all goes well, he won't want to leave. So there's no guarantee the Yankees will just swoop in and take everyone's stars. The landscape is changing.

The Yankee have a slew of guys getting to the point that their performance is going to start to decline and they just can't throw away all at the same time, Jeter, Pettite, Rodriguez, Posada, and Rivera. These are Yankee icons and ironically, could impede their progress.

There are concerns about ARod's hip, Jeter's range, Posada and Rivera's age and except for Jesus Montero, who they are trying to turn into a catcher, their system doesn't have anyone close to replace them.

There's no way Jetes moves to 3B because ARod is there, ARod can't move to 1B because Teixera is there, Posada can't be full-time DH because you probably have to use that position to rest an old regular. Jetes can't go to the OF, ala Robin Yount, because Granderson is out there, unless they move him to LF, do you want an inexperienced 36 or 37 OFer in that canyon? And don't forget, one of their FA acquisitions, Randy Winn, is a spry 36 and plays left. As Jack Nicholson and Diane Keaton once said, "Something's gotta give."

And as has been pointed out, there's a ton of age on that rotation. Beyond Pettitie, there's a ton of innings on Sabathia's arm, Burnett is past the law of averages for an injury, Vazquez has been up and down in his career, and while he is coming off his best ever, he is 33, 34 in June.

So yeah, the Yankees might look wonderful right now, all those superstars, but those guys have a very limited shelf life.

Gil's right, they can and probably will keep spending, but they are going to have to replace those guys almost at the same time. They will probably resign Jeter, but how much time does he have left at SS? So how much will they have to spend to reload?

I don't know, gil, even with all the money in the world, it sounds like the door is being forced open.

Josh. I'm with you on the Rays. They surprised everyone a couple of years ago and now there some sort of 'model' franchise and a blueprint to follow? Give me a break, they made their share of dumb moves-Cliff Floyd. Pat Burrell, trading Edwin Jackson and righ now they are no better than a 3rd or 4th place team.
They have some decent talent(Upton, Longoria, Garza) but they have already got into a cost-cutting mode by trading Kazmir and it looks like Carl Crawford is next.
I also took a look at their high ticket prices and no wonder attendance is so low!
Overall, I see the O's climbing past the Rays either this year or next so can't see the hype.

TerryP -

To say that the Rays have "some decent talent" is the understatement of the century.

I hope it's more than wishful thinking that the Yankees are getting old and will decline. The revenue stream will certainly be there, and even in recessionary times, their dollars will still outrank every other club. But, while every player wants to win, not every player wants to play in New York (for either team there). Ask Randy Johnson about that. Plenty of guys like different cities, smaller places, safer places, quieter places, less pressurized places. "If you can make it there, you can make it anywhere" might be the accepted mantra, but it's still possible to make it in other spots, and still make it BIG (ask Albert Pujols about that).

Ken,

Let's hope so. It would seem that the Steinbrenner boys can't keep the Ponzi scheme going on forever. I am so sick of the obnoxious drunken fans and their condescending superior attitudes. I took two of my sons to a night game last year and a Yankee Fan in front of me turned around{just after the Yankees scored bunch of runs},smiled and said "so how many losing years has it been now?" I felt like grabbing her by the throat.

I do think that a favorable number of the Orioles top prospects will make it in some form or fashion. Of the pitchers, maybe 50% merely due to attrition and injury.

PS - The Rays paid Cliff Floyd less than $3M on a one year deal and he put up an .800 OPS for them. I'd take that "dumb move" any day.

Edwin Jackson has experienced three months of above average success in his three full seasons. The jury's still out on that one.

At this point the Pat Burrell signing looks pretty stupid in hindsight, but how could anyone have predicted that, after averaging 28 homers and a .367 OBP over the course of his career, Burrell would drop to 14 homers and a .315 OBP? If Burrell comes back in 2010 and hits 25-30 homers, he'll be a decent bargain at $9M.

Re: notbrooks last comment. Don't you wish you could be just "decent" at your job and make $9 million bucks? As Branch Rickey once said, "It's not the price of stardom that kills you, it's the price of mediocrity."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!

Cashman exists in a world of limitless spending power. Any moron could run that team and completely ignore the farm system and ring up 90 wins a year. Where Cahsman will prove his worth is when Jeter, ARoid, Posada, Rivera all start playing their age and lay an egg.

The Sox are somewhat limited in spending by their 35000 seat stadium. That job is clearly more difficult than the Yanks job.

The TB GM position is like raising a family of 6 on a single income. Nearly impossible. In spite of that, he has done amazing in recent years compared to the garbage they drafted and brought along early on in the Franchise's history.

Gil-

Next time your response should be-

"Far fewer years than you've been an obnoxious drunk with poor diction and a terrible accent."

"Far fewer years than you were incarcerated."

"Far fewer years than it took you to decide to start waxing your upper lip and handle bar eyebrows."

etc etc etc

You know,SHAMROCK, I wish I could have thought of something to say other than, "please turn back around". She was a middle aged steriotypical New Yorker. You've been out there when the Yankees are in town. Their fans all call the Yankees players by their first names. "Oh, Derek is up next, Mark really crushed that one didn't he, Mariano is getting loose, this game is over let's head back to the hotel" etc.

Who in the hell cares what this typical SI filler fodder says ?
MacPhail is one of the best GM's going.
He's got the resume to prove it and he's building not only a winning team, but a winning culture in Baltimore.
Epstein is simply brilliant, period.
Friedman and Beene should both get honorable inclusion towards the top for working in small markets, although I see very little that Beene has done recently to command such respect.
He seems to have allowed an awful lot of good players to leave Oakland.

Cashman has indeed had the resources that no other GM has had and he's kept the Yankees competitive, though a lot of people seem to judge the Yanks on whether or not they win the World Series.... and that's not always fair.
As a GM, the best you can do is give your team a chance to win by selecting who you feel are the best players.
Sometimes those players don't formulate the right combination or injuries occur, or guys just have bad years.
To say "anyone" could do Cashman's job is a bit of a careless statement.
Don't sell him short in the brain department simply because his owner gives him a big budget.
He willingly let go of Damon and Matsui this past winter, and did the same 2 or 3 years back with Bernie Williams.
Smart moves all... and I'm sure, difficult decisions.
Say what you will about Posada being old.
He's still one of the best behind the plate and remains a dangerous clutch hitter. They have a real hot prospect that's supposed to be ready in a year or two. In the meantime, who's better than Posada to fill in?
Don't even mention Jeter and A-Rod.
Those guys are tops at their positions and are top-flight conditioned athletes who WILL still be potent players into theor 40's.
I do believe that the signing of the 300+ pound Sabathia will come back to bite Cashman when C.C. gets injured the first time.... and he WILL get injured because he's a fat slob.

Anyway.... I like Andy MacPhail.
I liked Lee MacPhail as well, for it was under Lee and Paul Richards that the Orioles first became respectable and a perenniel winner.

"Friedman and Beene should both get honorable inclusion towards the top for working in small markets, although I see very little that Beene has done recently to command such respect.
He seems to have allowed an awful lot of good players to leave Oakland."

Bear -

Since you typed those two sentences, I would hope that logic would tell you that the yearly exodus of talent from Oakland is directly related to the fact that Beane's working in a small market. Did you expect the A's to outbid the O's for Tejada or the Yanks for Giambi? The fact that the A's have been hamstrung by Eric Chavez's $11M per contract should be proof enough that they don't have the money to hang on to the loads of nice players they've developed.

But...

If you think the O's are on their way to being a winning team, you should take a look at the young talent in the A's system. They already have one of the best bullpens in the game and a great young 1-2 punch in their rotation in Brett Anderson and Trevor Cahill. And if Chris Carter and Michael Taylor can make the jump sometime soon and if Gio Gonzalez can get a head on his shoulders and Josh Outman is healthy, the A's could have the best young team in the majors in 2010/11.

Wow!

The Yankee's are getting old and will fade in a few years? Do people really believe that?

I didn't realize guys like Tex, cano, Arod, Granderson, CC and others really were that old. Add to that the fact they'll likely add a couple young free agents next year (see carl crawford), the year after that and the year after...... and, ummm... seriously?

I'm not saying it's right, and I agree with most posters regarding Cashman, but people..... Please!

And I'm not being negative here, but can someone really explain to me what AM has done the past 16 years? I'm being serious! Since the finance of baseball severely changed, how has AM ever shown that he can put a consistent winning team on the field ? I mean his record is not only bad, it's horrid!

He will be the commissioner one day however - a job that will suit him well!

Actually, at the time, YES... I would have expected the Athletics to have made a realistic effort to keep Tejada instead of putting all their eggs in one basket.... not exactly a smart move by Beene.
I recall at the time that Eric Chavez actually offered to take less money in order to help facilitate them keeping Tejada.
As for whoever their current prospects are, what's the difference? They will all end up going the way of Giambi, Zito, Hudson, Tejada, Holiday, Mulder, and the rest of the solid players Beene has allowed to leave.
He also clashed with, and therefore allowed Macha, one of the best managers in recent baseball history, to depart.
Beene is very, very overrated.
I think Beene's 15 minutes of fame came more as a result of his book than his actual accomplishments.

Bear -

You should argue the A's with an A's fan.

1. Prior to signing his six year contract, Chavez had put up a .280/.357/.513 average line with 30 homers per year. ~$11M per was a discount. It was either Chavez or Tejada. There was never any chance that the A's could have kept both of them. And, at the time, either one was a nice option.

2. You're right that the current crop of young A's will probably go the way of Giambi, Zito, Hudson, etc. But if the current crop takes the team to the playoffs a time or two or three, everyone in Oakland will be happy.

3. Since when was Ken Macha "one of the best managers in recent baseball history"? That's one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard.

4. Beane didn't write Moneyball. Michael Lewis did. Are you Joe Morgan?

One more thing: I missed your line about how Jeter and A-Rod "WILL still be potent players into their 40's" the first time I read that post.

Do this: Find me 10 MLB players who were "potent players" into their 40's and I'll find you 100 who weren't.

PS - You shouldn't argue the A's with an A's fan.

not brooks:

1. How about this..... Find me TWO players the caliber of Jeter and A-Rod and I'll find you TWO THOUSAND who are not.
I am not a Yankee fan, but players such as these two come along a handful of times in a generation.
They are both exceptional physical specimens who have had relatively injury-free careers.
That makes my prediction of their exceptional longevity quite reasonable.

2. To me, you're just another poster on this blog. Please do not attempt to validate your opinions, nor to invalidate mine based on the fact that you are an "A's fan".
I'm an Orioles fan and have been since 1954. I don't feel that makes my opinions superior to anyone else's.

3. Ken Macha was one of the reasons the A's remained competitive even when Beene kept letting players escape.
The players loved him and he was the best the A's have had since LaRussa.... who by the way, was yet another escapee.
I believe Macha compares favorably with Joe Maddon.
Ridiculous ? I think not.

4. I never said that Beene wrote "Moneyball".
But I do think most fans would consider the book to be centered around him and his theories...... and I stand by my previous statement that any notariety Beene has attained has been more a result of that book than his accomplishments.

Great, Bear, but my point was that 99% of MLB players don't perform well into their 40's. It has nothing to do with how great Jeter and A-Rod are currently. To suggest that they're definitely going to be great players into their 40's is just plain ignorant of the history of the game.

And I do think that my A's fandom gives me a better insight into the team than people who don't follow them as closely. I don't think that my opinion is superior to yours. I'm just seeing things that I've never heard in the 12 years that I've followed the A's.

For example, you suggested that the A's could have kept Eric Chavez and Miguel Tejada. That was never an option in Oakland.

And you said that A's players loved Ken Macha, which couldn't be further from the truth. When he returned the first time in 2005, several players disagreed with the move. After the 2006 season, some players even said they didn't want to return to the A's if Macha was still there.

As far as managerial skill goes, based on his time in Oakland, Macha was a horrible strategist. He also always left pitchers in too long and had no idea how to build a lineup. If the A's offense didn't score a run for a week, Macha would continue to trot out the same order, without even thinking about making a change.

Sorry about the confusion on Moneyball. I read this sentence: "I think Beene's 15 minutes of fame came more as a result of his book than his actual accomplishments." and figured when you said "his book", you meant that Beane wrote the book.

I'm not sure how anyone can simply sit with his arms folded and declare that "Keeping Chavez and Tejada was never an option".

Where there is a will, there is a way.

Chavez and Tejada were the best of friends and, as I mentioned above, Chavez even volunteered to take a cut in pay in order to help keep Tejada.

Tejada would have even taken less money to stay with the A's and he made that clear as well.

The problem was Beene. He resented the fact that Tejada was beyond his control. Tejada told everyone all during his last season in Oakland that he was open to negotiation.
The trouble was, Beene was not.

He called Tejada's bluff and Miguel proceeded to enter the free agent market.

Are you really claiming that the perenniel money-laden Orioles "outbid" the A's?

The A's never even tried to work it out.
Wait... let me rephrase that.......
BEENE never even tried to work it out, even though he had two players willing to negotiate in order to stay together.
Perhaps, like you, not brooks, Beene simply folded his arms and refused to believe it was an option.
I don't know. I wasn't inside his head.
And neither were you.

You keep repeating your point about 99% of players not playing into their 40's.

I got that the first time.

Do you get that Jeter and A-Rod are not part of the 99%.... but rather the 1% ?

If you do, then why the snide remark about being ignorant of the history of the game ?

I'll say this again:
I think Jeter and A-Rod will still be playing and playing very well when each has reached 40 and beyond.

These players are NOT the rule.
They are the EXCEPTION.
I make that assertion as a long time observer of the game and certainly not one who is ignorant of it's history.

What part of that don't you understand ?

Bear -

The old "This is the only team I've known and I've always wanted to play here" bit, huh? Seems like every free agent says that right before he cashes in on the biggest offer. Adrian Gonzalez is saying all the right things about San Diego and the Padres right now, but what do you really think is going to happen? Prince Fielder recently said he wants to stay with the Brewers for 30 years. I think his thoughts will change once he sees those dollar signs flashing from other cities after the 2011 season.

As far as the A's keeping Tejada and Chavez, I'm a "believe it when I see it" kind of guy. Until 2010, with Chavez and Ben Sheets, the A's had never had two $10M per year players on their payroll. And everything I've heard and read from Billy Beane (B-e-a-n-e), Steve Schott (former majority owner) and Lew Wolff (current majority owner) has led me to believe that they never had two such players because they could never afford it.

I'm not going to sit and wonder what Beane was thinking. I'm going to base my opinion on what I know of the situation. And there are two things I know about the Billy Beane A's. One: Beane has always done everything in his power to make the A's a competitive team and he has never turned down an opportunity to do so. Two: The A's don't have much money, so Beane has to get creative. And if that means picking Eric Chavez over Miguel Tejada for whatever reason (maybe it's because Bobby Crosby was tearing up AAA in 2003), I trust Beane to do what's best for the team.

Moving on to your Jeter and A-Rod being awesome as 40+ year olds bit...

I understand that both of those guys are part of the 1%. But, in A-Rod's case, you've got to look at the history of power hitters in their 40's. It's not pretty. And it's even uglier for known steroid users. Jeter, as one of the game's best pure hitters, has a better chance to excel as a 40+ year old, but still, the odds are heavily against him.

As a long time observer of the game, you should know that 99% of all players who stick around that long start to break down by 40 at the latest. Of course there are classic exceptions. Nolan Ryan is the exception. WIllie Mays was great in his 40 and 41 year old seasons. Tony Gywnn kept hitting until he hung up his spikes. But for each of those guys, there are hundreds who didn't make it to 40 (Robin Yount) or stuck around til 40, but shouldn't have (Cal Ripken).