'YOU WANT A PREDICTION ABOUT THE WEATHER (ORIOLES), YOU'RE ASKING THE WRONG PHIL (WAYNE). I'LL GIVE YOU A WINTER (ORIOLES) PREDICTION. IT'S GOING TO BE COLD (ANOTHER LOSING SEASON), AND IT'S GOING TO GREY, AND IT'S GONNA LAST YOU FOR THE REST OF OUR LIFE (OR UNTIL ANGELOS OWNS THE TEAM).

See Groundhog day today at 5pm (TNT). And think of your beloved O's!

'....... OR UNTIL ANGELOS SELLS THE TEAM' that is.....

That's right woodchuck-chuckers ---- It's Groundhog Day!

O's Style!

Peter,

I was one of the people, following the Orioles lead, who said the team would approach 500 last season. Obviously, I was beyond disappointed. Now, one year later, while 500 is the goal, it's doubtful they'll make it. Even you have predicted around 77 wins, if things go right.

At this point Pete, I'm neither positive or negative about the team. I find myself looking forward to the NFL draft much more than I do the opening of spring training. I also find myself continuing to be less and less interested in this team. It just gets old!

It seems to me that this team is very much like a minor league club -developing players, while never being concerned about the win/loss record.

I know some fans are true to the core, no matter what. Good for them! At some point however, it seems one would get tired of the hype and the losing.

I was in Atlanta a couple weeks ago having drinks at a sports bar with some clients. When it came to baseball, I was too embarrassed to say I was an Orioles fan. I know it's only baseball Peter, but I know i can't be alone.

Wayne,
What is with your feverish fascination with groundhogs? or is it with Bill Murray? Either way, get a new angle, you have beaten this horse so much, that it is now laughable when you post. I cannot believe that you get under people's skin. Exactly none of your arguments hold any water. You have lost your edge, oxygen thief.

snow ? cold? it's 73 degrees. oh wait. i live in boca where we're having spring training weather. may the schmuck be with you.

239 days remaining

fkterp, as a fellow floridian (orlando metro) i feel your pain. I'm cleaning the garage today in this awful 66 degree weather...although i do miss the snow a little, i don't miss 2 1/2 feet of it

Wayne,
The first post regarding Groundhog Day and the O's was not quite funny. Your repeating them reminds me of.......oh yeah Wayne. If anyone is stuck on one note it is you.
You are like in a time warp. All your negativity would have seemed more in place about 3-5 years ago. Now it's just annoying but I'm glad you only have a couple more weeks/months to do this because the young O's are hungry and we will make some noise this Year in the AL east!

Nick,

PERFECT!

It's because we get the same year in and year out from not only the O's, but posters like you.....

And I don't need to make an argument Nick ole boy. The O's do it for me every season..... without fail!

'WHAT WOULD YOU DO IF YOU WERE STUCK IN THE SAME PLACE AND EVERY DAY WAS EXACTLY THE SAME, AND NOTHING YOU EVER DID MATTERED'

warehouser deluxe,

great name by the way........

BUT 'hungry', 'will make some noise'? lol! That's what you got?

'THERE IS NO WAY THIS IS EVER GOING TO END, AS LONG AS THAT GROUNDHOG KEEPS SEEING HIS SHADOW. HE'S GOT TO BE STOPPED'

Peter,

Nice to see someone in Baltimore is working today. By the way, I didn't receive my Baltimore Sun today.

With all of this Snow, why can't this area- Baltimore/ Washington DC be considered for a future Winter Olympics. The home of past Olympic Champions -Kimmee Miesner & Michael Phelps.

We have more snow than Vancouver has, the site for next week's 2010 Winter Olympics.

We could set up the Luge on the BW Parkway today.

wayne -

Time for something new. After 957 posts, Groundhog Day is getting really stale, just like "Hail Mary" and whatever else came before it.

wayne=groundhog=small creatures
think about it.... have you ever seen them together at the same time?

The reason O's havent signed Hendrickson yet is because Greedy Petey thought MacCheap said it was $ 15 million deal , not actual $ 1.5 million .

The O's lack of 'meaningful' games this season gonna be more stale than Groundhog Day or Hail Mary

Dont say no one warned you before then

nb,

Perhaps like all your meaningless stats about players AM would never pull the trigger on..... that kind of stale?

At least comparing the O's to Groundhog Day is more relevant than dreaming about free agents this team would NEVER bring in.

And Thanks for reminding me of this years team saying.....

'The 2010 O's - Tossing a 'Hail Mary''

Wayne,
You never answer questions that are presented to you directly, instead you pussy foot around the question, and provide your "blueprint" answer, "you are a warehouser", or, "groundhogs day", or some other absurdity. You managed to muster one answer for questions that were never asked by me, but you DID manage to dodge the 2 questions I posed to you....so which is your grotesque erotic fascination with, the groundhog, or Bill Murray? Really, which is it?

Please don't skirt the issues, bridge dweller, for as long as you post nonsensical ramblings, I will be there to make you look like the mule-headed simpleton that you are....not that you need any help convincing anyone that you are a mule-headed simpleton.

Tom,

The Orioles are a sad state of affairs, to be sure. The true believers will want a parade for 77 wins and constantly post any obscure internet prognostication they can find that says the Orioles are making"progress" After last year progress would just be completing the 162 schedule without forfeits.

Going into his fourth year Macphail has yet to add any marquee talent to the the major league roster and had another lackluster offseason when it comes to gettting the big club in a position to have a winning record. The Garrett Atkins signing was an example of going cheap for a player on the wrong side of his career by all staistical measurements.

The true believers try to spin the Miguel Tejada panic signing, {with only the pathertic Joe Crede left}, as a brilliant Macphail move as he "fell" to the Orioles. Right. We just signed a 36 year old career shortstsop to play third base and it was "brilliant"

As Wayne says, soon the Macphail Hosanna chorus will be saying that it never was about 2011 anyway.
It is sad when the team you root for is planning to lose again in 2010 and pitchers and catchers haven't even reported.

Gil, or Wayne lite
Here's an alert for you.....
The O's are not "planning to lose" this year
Neither Macphail or Trembley nor any of the players, nor true fans for that matter are "planning to lose" You and Wayne are planning to lose which is obvious from your pessimism and not even basic understanding of this years moves and how the moves we made make sense.
Oh well, you can always jump on the bandwagon in June when it's obvious Macphail's plan is working. Until then you can wallow in your misery I suppose.

Ok,

Well, Wieters, Matusz. Bergesen and whole bunch of quesions arrive in 11 days! Maybe AM could have ensured we had a couple more proven, yet not over the hill pitchers and maybe even a solid back up behid the plate versus giving away 4 outs every 4th game!

But were gonna buy the bats and raise the arms! Who are you guys kidding!

Hey Gil,
The Sun just posted an article for you.
Of course, unless you know more about switching from short to third than Cal, it shouldn't be a problem. Weather Miggy can make the transition effectively Cal's words were "no doubt about it". Brooks thinks he will do "great". Yeah but what would Brooks know about it?
Again, you may not be a mathemetician, but Macphails 3rd anniversary is this year. 3rd full year coming up. That would make the 4th next year. Perhaps you could withdraw your post and repost next year.....no that won't do because your negativity will have been proved to be just that....negativity for the sake of it and not related to the facts.
The facts don't help your case sometimes.

Wow, Stu
You've already picked out the back up catcher and you are so concerned they won't hit. That truly proves the team is much farther alongthan even us warehousers thought. Thanks for helping with my optimism!

2008 O's Fanfest - 'its not about this year ' , Andy MacCheap

2009 O's Fanfest - 'its not about this year ' Andy MacCheap

2010 O's Fanfest - ' its not about this year ' Andy MacCheap

2011 O's Fanfest - 'its not about this year ' Andy MacCheap

2012 O's Fanfest - 'its not about this year ' Andy MacCheap

2013 O's Fanfest - 'its not about this ..........

Yo,

12 years and looking to 13 or 14 unless the Baltimore fans can send PA a message much like Washington fans and John Riggins sent to Dan Snyder. Message was received loud and clear just down the road, however, Lil Dan had pissed off the Post so they were on his @$$, but not here in the Charm city, here they drink the Kool Aid and actually suggest a competitive team.

Much like the Obviously 5 Believers, trust me my friends, it will be you, saying mea culpa to Wayne, Gil and myself not later than 15 June! Read it and weep, the truth hurts, but the Truth will set you free!

obviously 5 believers...

somebody should write a song with that title....oh, somebody already has? hmmmm. Anyway, maybe if we all ignore the "nattering nabobs of negativity" maybe they'll go away.

Hey Dave,
yeah I think ignoring would be a better course to take and most likely to go your way and I go mine will be fitting

Hey Gil,

There's another 'Bandwagon' post. Have you ever seen this wagon? Do you know where it'll be?

I don't know about you Gil, but I'll knock people out of the way in order to get a good seat on the Wagon...... But where the hell is it?

Also, all worry's aside Gil, The SUN, with thier crack reporting says Miggy will do fine at 3rd. Why? Because Cal and Brooks say so! It does beg the question however...... what in the hell did anyone expect Cal and Brooks to say? lol!

Pasadena Nick,

If I remembered seeing your questions, maybe I'd consider replying.... And that's a slight maybe. Problem is Nick, anything anyone says (including myself) gets the generic warehouse losers lament. That's why I'll answer your question, only if I'm in the mood. Otherwise, your questions are incredibly boring (go ahead, give your witty and generic comeback about how my post are boring...mr originality!).

And by the way, every time you try to make me look like a mule-headed simpleton, you once again paint yourself as someone most already know you are..... a warehouser.

NOW WHERE IN THE HELL IS THAT BANDWAGON! I LOOKED ON THE ORIOLES SITE AND - NOTHING!

DAMN!

the Kool-Aid tastes better than the Hater-Aid wayne drinks.

hater.

Keith, Gil, Allan........

WHERE THE HELL IS THIS BANDWAGON THEY KEEP TALKING ABOUT?

Do you guys know? Is it being build now? Can you buy a ticket in advance?

Maybe if we all go in together, we'll get a discount.........

Hell, I'm heading to Google now.... gotta find this dang Wagon

Allan,
Where did you hear AM say it wasn't about this year? He actually said the opposite, That it was time for accountability regarding wins and losses. That doesn't sound like "It's not about this year". Trembley and Macphail are expecting the team to be competetive THIS YEAR.
As evidenced by the 12,000 at fan fest I think many of us are expecting the same thing.

Thoughts for a snow day.

The Orioles are putting together some pretty good young and middle of the road ballplayers. After this season is over I think the Orioles will put out some money for 2 or 3 free agents who can see the light of all of this. This year should be fun to watch. Next year should be compelling.

LOL, Hey you guys, you better hurry if you want to find out more about the wagon. Obviously 5 and dave are going away. Maybe if you're nice to them they'll fill you in. Funny stuff!

There it is, nobull gives us the first 'next year' of the day, complete with getting 2 or 3 free agents. Wayne, heard that before?

Oh, and of course there was the - this year should be fun to watch. Nice!

We have witnessed numerous franchises in numerous sports that have gone from rags to riches or from riches to rags and then back to riches. Metaphorically speaking of course. The Rays come to mind in baseball. How about the Saints? They have endured decades on losing but that is a distant memorey now. How about the miracle Mets? How about the Dallas Cowboys? They made it to the playoffs 17 consecutive seasons in the 60', 70's and early eighties before becoming big time losers in the late eighties. They then became THE team of the early 90's winning 3 out of 4 Superbowls between 92 and 95.

The point is, the fan base of any team that has endured numerous losing seasons has a hard time seeing the light at the end of the tunnel. Often they are the last to see the sea change. For the Orioles I believe the sea change is AM. This team is being built from the ground up. Just a few years ago the Orioles farm system was the laughing stock of MLB. While the O's still have a ways to go to be an elite farm system, they are miles better than before and heading in the right direction.

I am not sure 2010 will be much better than 2009. It is almost impossible to predict how well or bad the young nucleous of this rotation will do. How much does Millwood have left in the tank? Can JGuth return to form? Can Bergy avoid the sophmore jinx? How much progress did Tillman and Matusz make over the off season? What about Hernandez and Berken? How bout Simon, the forgotten man who was made the rotation out of spring training last year only to end up on the DL? We just do not know the answers to these questions. If the young guns do not take the next step in their progression, we are looking at close to 100 losses or more. If the young guys make some progress and the veterans (Millwood and JGuth) are solid, we could win 80 to 90 games. Maybe we fall somewhere in the middle... We don't know...

I am only saying it is way too soon to write off these last few seasons as more of the same. Because it simply is not. A clear change in direction has been made. I think it will eventully pay off at some point. Hopefully sooner rather than later...

Damn,

Guys, I Googled Bandwagon... specifically the O's Bandwagon.

And much to my dismay, it likely won't be ready until 2017. When I researched further, it said they came up with this date due to how long it took AM in Chicago.

I mean that sounds about right, especially having watched AM's conservative approach up close. It's just that some of the posters got me excited.

Darn you warehousers! You had me going there!

somebody tell a joke

Wayne - I dont know about this 'bandwagon' you asking about , but I do know there are warehousers and there are realists .

Obvi 5- You're correct , 12,000 folks did turned up for Fanfest , however..........
expecting the same thing and getting the same thing are two DIFFERENT things .

nobull - ' after this season is over , i think the O's will put out some money for 2 or 3 free agents who can see the light of all this'

If you talking about the Joe Credes , Braden Loopers , etc , YES

if you talking about Tim Linecum , Pujol , King Felix , Mauer , Fielder ,etc ,,,,,,,Not a snowball's chance in hell

A joke?

You mean the Orioles aren't enough of one?

Allan

Careful, the warehousers will jump all over you about some of those names, thus ignoring your point.

Guys like Tim L and Felix won't be available, as one won't be a FA yet and the other just got a big contract.

BUT, I get your point..... and it's spot on!

Doug

The warehousers dont have any jokes , thats why Wayne volunteered some jokes for us

Wayne - Thanx ! No worries , they will get my point after couple more empty handed offseasons

Annoymous - That O's Kool Aid gonna taste like RX cough syrup by june 30th

Gil -

I just find it interesting that some people criticize MacPhail's slow, methodical way of doing things (and rightly so), and then say that he made a panic signing. How does that make any sense?

Pete Schmuck - When you lived in Anaheim , have you ever seen snow fall there ?

Not Brooks- Its not MacCheap's slow methodical way that concerns me , my question is .........is it going kill O's rebuilding plan if MacCheap signs even ONE premium superstar free agent?
Look at San Franc Giants , they signed busts like Barry Zito YET they still WIN

.............................................................................................
Pete's reply: I actually grew up in Santa Ana, right next to Anaheim, and the last time it snowed there was in 1949 -- which was way before my time. If you want to see snow in Orange County, you have to drive up Saddleback Mountain.

and it's Zito's contract that prohibits the Giants from going after A-Gon or Fielder with a bag load of money.

...not saying they'll spend it.

wait, the only point he made is that he has no clue about what players are available, and the chances that the others will be. Mauer is gonna resign with the Twins, Fielder with the Brewers. That leaves Pujols out of his list. I guess if we can't trust the guy to figure that out...we better keep him out of the GMs chair.

the giants have a whole bunch of homegrown arms. your team has that and you want to criticize. But hey, why not do a little research and YOU tell me why YOU think the Giants are winning?Or maybe you like having someone else do the work for you while you post your silly little comments.

Not Brooks,

I believe Tejada was a panic signing. He screwed around in typical Macphail fashion until Crede was basically all that was left, unless of course he was willing to trade one of the holy prospects. He could have signed Tejada at any point. Macphail really didn't want Tejada back, I guarantee you.

Somebody esle posted that I didn't think Tejada could play third base. I think he can play third base and dodge line drives as well as Ty Wiggenton any day, maybe even better. Frankly, I could care less about what Brooks and Cal think about Tejada's transition to third. They were normal players who didn't shoot themselves in the ass with B12 and lie about their age. For all we know Tejada could be 46.

Gil,

You could care less what the two greatest third basemen in Orioles history think about the Orioles third baseman? Just out of curiosity, whose opinion would you care about?

Of course the Orioles are planning to lose again. I submit that they are no better than last year going in. The starting rotation has three green and unproven pitchers and I would like someone to get on and tell me how the bullpen is demonstrably better than it was going in last year.

Go ahead, tie yourself in knots and tell me that Garrett Atkins is going to return to 2006 form and that Adam Jones will stop running into walls and trying to pull every pitch out of the park. Tell me that Felix Pie is the real deal. Tell me that jeremy Guthrie will stop leaving the ball in the middle of the plate and win 15 games.

Hope doesn't mean a damn thing in the standings. Andy Macphail failed deliberatley to put the team in a position to have a winning record in 2010. I don't want to talk about the prospects anymore. Macphail just pissed away another season.

Joe,

Brooks and Cal are speaking from their own experience and their opinions have absolutely no bearing on what Tejada does. Brooks didn't have the range or arm to play short and Cal started as a third baseman and was moved to short by Weaver. Tejada has always played short. T ejada is not going to adapt well to the position at this stage of his career. But there is always hope Joe.

Paulie - Who is to say they wont spend it on AGonz or Fielder ? The Giants draw more and more fans because they play (as Wayne puts it ' meaningful games ).
They just added Huff for $ 8 mill deal . Giants FO want to field winning team and they dont make excuses , unlike O's FO .

Jim66 - If someone wants do the work for me , who am I to refuse ? LOL

HOWEVER , if you scroll back , you will see I was the one who brought up Giants' example first. How did the Giants made 16 game improvement ? They scored 17 more runs and their pitching gave up 148 runs less than the 2008 season. Their total payroll is $ 82.6 million , which puts them # 14 on MLB list. Where is O's payroll ? Oh # 26 and dropping fast . And to top it off , I did the work on Giants , thank you very much

Gil,

I wasn't making a judgment about Tejada's ability to play third in my post. All I asked was if you don't care about Cal or Brooks' opinion on the subject, whose opinion would you be interested in. And, this is a shock to everyone who reads this blog regularly I'm sure, you failed to answer the question, choosing instead to put words into my mouth about "hope." Of course, you are probably right. Instead of believing what two Hall of Famers say about Tejada, we should believe you and your vast wealth of experience playing both third and shortstop in the major leagues.

Cue "warehouser" comment from Wayne in 3,2....

Please count with me Macphail Hosanna singers...

June 2, 2007, Macphail is hired and is here for two thirds of the season. That is one.

2008...is two

2009...is three.

2010 is his FOURTH DAMN SEASON. I know you probably think of it as three, but let's do it more slowly...2007...2008...2009...2010

Joe I just gave you a reason why both players opinions don't matter. They were great players in their own right but their circumstances wre not Tejadas.

Earl Weaver thought Andres Mora was going to be the next Mickey Mantle. How did that "opinion" work out?

Gil,

Implicit in your post is that, rather than believe Cal and Brooks, we ought to believe you. Could they be wrong? Of course. Tejada could be a disaster and you could be proven correct. That would, I'm sure, be outstanding for you.

But, even if Cal and Brooks didn't have the same career arc as Tejada, are you honestly going to sit there and say that their opinions on this matter are irrelevant? They are Hall of Fame players, and two of the greatest Orioles of all time. Even if you disagree with them, their opinion carries a hell of a lot more weight than someone who is posting on a blog. I include myself in that latter distinction, by the way. So, knock yourself out saying Tejada is going to be terrible, but don't embarrass yourself by saying Cal and Brooks' opinions don't matter.

Allen,
Are you trying to compare a 16 game improvement in the National League West by the Giants and the O's trying to do the same thing in the AL East?

Payroll is a completely unrelated arguement as spending more does not guarantee winning more...

Signing big ticket players is as risky as waiting for the development of prospects. For every signing that is successful, there are plenty that aren't. If we signed Holliday, Bay, or Lackey and they came here and pulled a Zito, people would be blasting AM for throwing money away on a useless player. You guys on here who keep talking about payroll really do not have a clue what it takes to run a team (not saying that I would do any better), or have a real grasp of what free agents are looking for. Money is just part of the equation. You have to have a team that is ready to compete, and up to this point, these young guys have not proven anything. If our pitching improves this year, Baltimore will be a much more attractive destination for big ticket hitters. We have a great hitter's ballpark, a die-hard fan base (when the team is winning), a historical relevance, and a good core of young players.
If you were a highly desired free agent this offseason, would you have signed with Baltimore? I think next year will be different if the expected progress comes to fruition...

Joe, I have never used the term warehouser in my posts I don't believe in the warehouse conspiracy. Oriole employees are too incompetent to organize one. I answered your questions. Of course it doesn't take Werner Von Braun to figure out that a shortstop should be able to play third base. I don't think that Ripken and Robinson's comments are a scoop.

I don't think Tejada's situation is similar to Ripken's or Robinson's. They are good people who are talking out of their ass.

Gil,

To start, I never said you were going to call me a warehouser, nor do I think there is any such thing.

But, you're right. Cal and Brooks are well meaning old codgers talking out of their asses. You and Wayne and the other people who consistently say the Orioles have no hope, that there is a deliberate attempt not to compete, and that the rest of us are idiots for having any sort of hope are the people we should be listening to. I can't believe I didn't see it before. I mean, bashing the team repeatedly from the anonymity of the internet is truly courageous. Screw Cal and Brooks and anyone in the media who says this team has good talent and a chance at being better this year. They are so obviously wrong and you are so obviously right.

Wayne, can I get a Hail Mary t-shirt? I'm on the team fellas!

Gil, you were a banker?

June 2, 2007-June 1, 2008 Year 1
June 2, 2008-June 1, 2009 Year 2
June 2 2009-Feb 6, 2010 Year 3/4
June 2, 2010 BEGINS his 4th year.

Total 2 3/4 years today on the job. Slow enough?

Seriously Joe, what were you thinking? Maybe now that you've seen the light, you can do what wayne does and really stick it to the orioles by cancelling your season tickets (nope). or not going to fanfest (nope) or getting on the mic at fanfest and asking AM a tough question, you know, really hold his feet to the fire (nope). Show them how much you can't stand the product by not going to see them in spring training (nope, although still to be seen).

THAT'LL SHOW THEM!

Gil,

I'll disagree with one thing you said. I absolutely believe the front office is competent enough to create a pool of 'spinners' for the O's. Whether it be Blogs, Radio shows..... you name it, it is 100% one of the things they do to spin the O's in a positive light.

I came up with the term 'warehousers' and I know they exist. Are all positive posters warehousers? No! Enough are though.

You've seen the same arguments, the same one liners, the same tone from so many.... and you know who some are.

Where the O's lack complete competence is in the ability to give warehousers material to work with. They're simply giving these people an impossible long term task.

Being called 'negative' means nothing to me. I stopped being positive a few years ago and have been asking them to prove me wrong ever since. They never do.

Even when they hired AM, it wasn't difficult to see this guys track record since free agency became a real challenge. He has failed miserably for well over a decade and while he is to be commended for helping the O's minor league system, he does not know how to build a competing major league club.

Negative would be if the O's won 78 to 82 games last year, and I was still blasting them.

Instead, they showed zero growth at the major league level last year, while becoming a laughingstock throughout baseball.

Oh sure, some execs and writers are saying nice things about the O's. But do they think they're winners? Not even close!

They were embarrassing losers last year, and they're staring at yet another terrible season.

But what will we get Gil? That it was never about this year, and that a double digit increase in wins means is substantial.

Question: When does a double digit increase in wins NOT MATTER?
Answer: When the team only won 64 games the previous season.

Not negative..... Just a fact!

cush,

We don't have to put our money where our mouth is. This is the internet! I can say whatever I want on here with no consequences attached whatsoever! Think the offseason sucked? Show the front office how mad you are by quoting Groundhog Day! Think Tejada is a bum? Call out Brooks and Cal for talking out of their ass! Think Macphail hasn't been on the job 4 years? Screw your calculator and facts!

"[Mark Hendrickson] ... remains in some kind of unexplained medical limbo ... I mean, it's not like he signed [an] $80 million contract." - Peter Schmuck

From what I understand, the Oriole process is far more extensive than it is with any other team. I'm not naming names and I am not going to say what some of the extensiveness is. I will just say it is a first-hand source and I believe the person.

Furthermore, it has nothing to do with $80M or a one-year contract at half of the major league average.

Let's just remember Peter the Grate is a lawyer who specializes in leverage, and will try to gain such at all times and at all cost.

Could it just be that if the O's announce the Hendrickson signing, they have to make a roster move? Maybe they are just holding out so that they don't put someone on waivers that might get claimed by other teams.... Once other team's rosters are full, they will announce the signing... right pete?

Q: When does a double digit win increase not matter?

A: When the team won 64 games the year before.

Wayne #1, you're saying the orioles will win at least 74 games next year? WOW that's down right giddy for you.

#2 I'm looking through my book of who decides what matters and what doesn't and you don't seem to be in it.

#3 ITS AN OPINION, not a fact.

cush and joe,

Heard it before....... maybe be a little more interesting perhaps?

And stop the lies.... Gil never criticized Brooks and Cal. Instead, he was making a point, something far beyond your grasp.

Yep, I'll be going to spring training for a few days (a couple different times) and I'll hit the Yards again in 2010. Why? Because I love baseball.

The Orioles are a disaster though that can not be cured with the current ownership in place. They were a disaster last year, will be this year, and likely will be one again next year. The history has simply become to overwhelming to ignore.

Because of this, I enjoy other teams like I never dreamed I would. When I'm on the road, it's simply a joy to catch good baseball... and guess what guys? Every city but two played better baseball than the O's last year.

So should I just start rooting for another team? Perhaps! But I'm closest to the Yard, thus I'll keep my tickets for now and will hit as many games as I can.

Hope to see you there!

Allan prove your claim that the Giants 83m payroll was responsible for their 16 game improvement last yr. What was the payroll the year before and who was making how much. Then, compare it to last yr. What players contributed to the increase in salary, if there were any. Any free agents get signed? Who were the critical players in the improvement?
Salary increases for them? Did the Giants just end up spending more money on their own players?

Having the untradeable at any price Zito eating up 20% of payroll cannot be a good thought. Oh, Zito and Johnson and Renteria, Winn, and Molina were 50m of their 82. Hmmm. Now that's a well run ballclub.

Bringing up the Huff signing as an example of a team's desire to win is silly.
I'll make a crazy prediction: Huff ends up being exactly what he was in 2 out of his 3 yrs with the Os. I mean the guy could not even put up decent numbers in the walk yr of his contract.

"You've seen the same arguments, the same one liners, the same tone from so many.... and you know who some are."

wayne | February 6, 2010 7:25 PM

there goes that pot calling the kettle black thing again.

As a paid employee of the O's, and a Pro-scout, I can say with authority that some fans have had input into crafting our message of young talent. Well, that and the fact that the Organization has made an investment in youth and we seek to see our investment mature.

INSIDER TIP: wayne is actually our boss here at the PR department...he's this mad genius type of believes in the reverse psychology.

damn jim66...go easy on him...lol.

INSIDER TIP (2): I am actually Pete, and Pete is yours truly!

Crazy. I know!

w, you're telling me to be more interesting? Dude, you're captain redundancy. If you enjoy other teams, don't go see the Os for ST, go to Clearwater and see the Phils or Tampa for the Yankees.

And no, you haven't heard what i said before...go through the last 100 years of this blog and nobody has told you that you're not in the book of who decides what matters and what doesn't. Nobody has called you 'giddy' for predicting 10 more wins than last year either.

And a point being 'far beyond my grasp?' I'm not an idiot dude. I grasp everything said on this blog except that Andy's been here 4 years. He's been here 2 3/4 years.

I don't lie and I don't fill this blog with bluster then not back it up with action. I'm a cup 1/2 full person (maybe 1/4 full for the Os) who doesn't think this year will be a disaster. As someone said i think the Os won 64 last year on their way to 74-78 this year on their way to 81-85 the next. Do i think PA and AM will what it takes to take the next step? Right now I doubt it. If they don't show improvement I'm hoping for because of what I consider crappy mgmt, I'll stop giving them my money.

you know, wayne, when Pete says it, it's kinda funny ha-ha.

when you, say it, it sounds kinda...

...anyone seen the movie The Fan with Robert Deniro?

I would have to say I am with the kool aid drinkers side but wayne and the guys are right we haven't brought a good free agent in in years since Tejada and we bring him back when he is old aka Kevin Millar. Why do we keep bringing guys in at the end of there career. I like Miggy being back, but who is going to bat Cleanup for us. We are asking to much to think 7 sophmores are going to step up and give us enough to contend. I like the talent we have just it is kind of like playing the lottery. How many numbers are going to show up?

pj,

Didn't you hear? Guys like Miggy and Atkins were brought in to hold spots for guys like Bell and Snyder, the two hall of fame prospects who will be rookie corners on a team that's suppose to compete. A jolly good plan it is.

paulie, come on bro, stop being so bitter. The great thing about Pete is, you can get into his head for a moment, then he turns it around and has fun with it. You though, just stay mad and bitter.

Pete knows the Orioles will be awful. He just can't come right out and admit such. You though paulie, you also know they'll be terrible, but you'll soon do what Pete can't.....turn to the dark side..... When you do, you'll feel free....... so free!

Hey cush.... lighten up snow angel! I'll even let you buy me a beer down in sota.

Hey Gil,
Good try on the 4th year thing. It does suit your purpose to try to propose that Macphail has had 3 years already.
No, this is his 3 rd year of his imprint on the club. 2 offseasons correct?
You worked at a bank so you must have some sense. You realize that Macphail had zero, nothing, nada, less than zero to do with the makeup of the club when he came here in the summer of 07?
So, 07 is not a season that he had any input on the roster that was there. O'K hopefully you will post your retraction.

Gil,

I'll say it for you......

Unbelievable!

me, the dark side....you are funnier than I thought.

maybe as funny as I am...

obviously 3rd offseason wrapping up 3rd full season with HIS players coming soon. You do get that right?

IMHO, an althete who can play SS in the majors at an All-Star level shouldn't have too much trouble adapting to 3B. Sure, the skill set is a slightly different, but only ever so slightly different, and 3B is less demanding. It all comes down to simply catching the ball and throwing it. Any decent major league SS-2B could probably do a more than adequate job at any of the infield positions given a little time. Miggy will be fine at 3B, he's an offensive upgrade over Mora, and we can hope that Bell is the man of the future.

obviously 5,

By HIS players, are you talking about guys like Bergesen and Reimold, players AM is depending on in 2010, yet had nothing to do with?

Or maybe HIS guy Weiters, whom he got to sign only after he was drafted by the previous regime?

Maybe you mean guys like BRob and Markakis, who were already here when AM arrived...

I mean I can think of others as well, but are you suggesting all the players I've mentioned, as well as others need to move on before we really get to see HIS players?

Just asking?

Wayne.
Yes, yes, yes, and no
thanks for asking

Pitchers and catchers reporting can't come soon enough. At least it will give us something better to argue about.

BHock,

something better to argue about....oh you're an optimist too huh.

filthy warehouser. :)

Tony P - I was using Giants' success as an example that you can rebuild AND sign a big name free agent at SAME TIME.
Yes , you are right if O's signed a big name free agent and if he became a bust , the fans and media would have blasted O's FO ( or MacCheap to be exact) for wasting millions on wrong/bad free agent choice . My point is , your team can only go so far on draft picks/farm system ALONE . Sooner or later , you have to augement your team with a free agent slugger here or a free agent ace/ or # 2 starter there .
You asked me if I was highly desired big name free agent , would I want to sign with O's ? That is a tricky question because 1) Am I an O's fan ? 2) Am I local resident of Balto or Md area ? If I am not either of those ,then my answer is NO , I would sign with Yanks , Red Sox , Dodger , Cards , etc ....caliber of team . Then I would have the money AND winning club.

Jim66

Since you dont get it , I say it again .
Giants total payroll = $ 83 million
O's total payroll = $ 60 million

Giants record 88-74
O's record 64-98

You dismissed the Giants because of Zito , Winn , Renteria , Huff , Aguliria , etc, etc, and its not a good thought you said ?
I tell you what is not a good thought , O's 68-98 record , for 5th place finish .

The Giants proved you can spend money to win while you rebuilding .
How many times did Jason C tried explain that to you ?

I give you a crazy prediction of my own , Huff will have better season than your Garrett Atkins .

Who are AM Guys? Would that be Aubry, Pie, Millwood, Atkins, Gonzo, Miggy, and some of those seasoned starting pitchers we had last year? I really only see Adam Jones as the significant thing AM has brought us to date! Really, and at the same time in one swift move, the Yanks got Granderson??????? You call all this minor league/leftover acquisitions adding value and improving? I see just continued regression, and AM taking credit for resigning BRob and Nick, signing Wieters and taking more credit for some players others drafted.

Lets talk about his record? Remember this year were counting! I find that statement hillarious, have we been playing little league and not keeping score! Ask the fans, or better check attendance. And as for trying or at least keeping score, lets start with payroll!

Face it, we are the Raiders of the NFL. No one wants to coach here, only guys who feel this is their only chance to Manage what is supposed to be a Major League franchise, but even the managers figure it out that they have no chance, so the GM only starts counting after the 3 years of futility!

The GM is on the clock too, but he has nothing to worry about, propagating the myth of having a plan and making millions of dollars for his owner, he's very safe until he becomes commissioner!

I think it was said we will buy the bats and raise the arms? Well, we bought a bunch of broken and wore out bats, and the only players that agreed to come here were out of other major league options and were really cheap!

Realism, is a quality that people here really need to understand, spring is eternal and might last until mid May or June, but for those of you who actually post here about willing, as in even winning 75 games this year, please take your valium early and often!

Cush,Joe

Yes I was a banker for 40 years and a damn good one. Probably made both of you a Mortgage, Car or Credit car loan somewhere along the way. Or maybe I foreclosed on one, repossessed one, or sued you, who knows.

I have never called anyone on this board a derogatory name or called anyone an idiot, although the board is certainly full of them.

Macphail started in June 2007. This is 2010. He is going into his fourth SEASON with the team, full or not.

You can have all of the hope that you want. I'm a pragmatist, what else would you expect from a banker? I look at the facts, not what I want them to say.

Both of you, go shovel some snow and clear your heads, come back and look at the roster and tell me how the Orioles escape last place in 2010. Try to limit the use of the word "IF" to 20 or less incantations.

paulie,

Yes, I'm sure we'll still see some of the same old arguments rehashed from both sides even after there's something more worthy of discussion, but my hope is that they are drowned out by the comments that add value to this blog. Then again, I also hope the Orioles will finish above .500 - if I were betting, I'd take the under on the O's and the over on worthless arguments, but I can hope, can't I?

Wow Gil,

It's like watching the last Star Wars prequel where the Dark Lord begins to turn his young apprentice into Darth Vader sometimes. Not that I can't see why you got sharper tongued on that last comment, but he's been trying all winter with you. I'll say this though just to be a devil's advocate. Prior to the season ever starting, can you say how the Yankees or Red Sox will win the World Series without using "IF"?

Allan,

Your argument is flawed. The Giants were a BUST for signing Zito. 11-13, 10-17, 10-13 for the Giants in the last 3 years. $18.5MM in a LOSER in 2009. You just proved the point of why NOT to go buy guys like that. The Giants win because of *drumroll* the pitcher that they brought through their system! Their best player Lincecum was never a free agent.

Well, since I thought this post was about snow...I guess I'll comment on that.

We had well over two feet here in Montgomery County. I just shoveled most of the snow in our driveway with my dad. It's insane!

Allan, in 100 words or less, explain the Texas Rangers 87 wins last year, and compare their payroll with the Giants.
Or Tampa, which won a few less games in a tougher division.
Your payroll argument falls flat. I get it, conveniently leave out the teams with lower or similar payrolls that had better records, because the money argument does not wash. You still don't get it. When you start talking about team payroll, you have to consider the players and their salaries.
If you don't, you get a distorted picture of the situation. Do you think that group I mentioned is worth 50m dollars? The Giants overpayed for each and every one of those players, hiked their payroll unnecessarily, and you reward them for it. They should be rewarded because they have 20 players not making all that much money who performed really well.
Pick a better example than the Giants.How does Zito and his salary help your case? The poor performances of Zito and his 18m salary will hamstring that club until he's off the books.

Gil, because I know you can take a joke...
~I'm a pragmatist, what else would you expect from a banker?
Oh, I don't know, a mortgage and investment crisis caused by
a wildly imaginative financial sector and a gov't bailout?

"Macphail started in June 2007. This is 2010. He is going into his fourth SEASON with the team, full or not."

Gil... that line is negatively deceiving, regardless of the technical accuracy.

He came on halfway into the 2007 season, and evaluated the club (and managed to sign Matt Wieters).

Hes been on the job 2.5 years, not 4. He is going into the third season under "the plan". Its like saying Brian Matusz has a years worth of experience when he is still ROY qualified. Or, in financial sales telling people you have been in the business two years, when its actually 8 months straddled over two calendar years. As Bill O'Reilly would say, its SPIN.

Give the guy at least another year or two before you all run him out of town. The O's franchise was an unmitigated disaster when he came on. He basically liquidated the marketable assets they had (Bedard, Tejada, Sherrill), held on to the real value (Roberts, Markakis) and completely revamped the farm system and

Too many fans make too much of certain non-happenings. They didn't sign Sano (maybe they didn't like the guy?), they didn't sign Holliday/Figgins/Lackey (maybe there wasn't enough there to merit the investment?). There is always more to what is going on and they know more than we do.

I think the next steps are:

1. Finding a big time manager next year (sorry Dave)
2. Making two-three significant splashes next season in Free Agency (I like Crawford, a big bat, front line SP, beef up BP)
3. Picking a near-mlb ready hitter with the #3 pick int he draft ala Matt Wieters.
4. Get something for Luke Scott while he's HOT (June?)

This isn't apologizing, its analyzing. Can't change or drone on about the past, only recognize what was done and what needs to be done better in the future.

James C., jim66

Yes, I am cranky after shoveling snow for 8 hours after finding out my brand new snow blower from Sam's club was probably included in the Toyota recall.

Jim, I was not an investment Banker on Wall street, the type of Trolls who strictly specialiized in packaging groups and batches of Mortgage loans securitized by our 401K's and insured by AIG. They should all be given a cigarette and a blindfold, shot on Wall Street and their bodies thrown from the top floor of the Empire State Building.

Shamrock,

#2 and # 3 should have been done this offseason to make the team competetive and to develop more fan interest. Working the plan for rebuilding the farm system has been a spectacular success. Attending to the quality of the talent level at the major league level has been an unmitigated disaster...64 wins...are you kidding me?

but Gil... there wasn't anyone this year worth blowing money on this year.

I wasn't a big fan of the Hobgood pick, but as for getting a hitter last year in the draft, with Ackley and Tate off the board, there was no one left worth taking at 5. After the 4th pick, next the position player taken was Grant Green (SS) and he was a reach at 13. Hopefully Hobgood works out.

The bullpen is going to be pretty solid this year. I would venture to say in the same league with the BoSox and much better than the Yankees. They have the potential to have a sub 4.00 ERA BP this year if everyone stays healthy and doesn't get worked into oblivion.

guess not

SHAMROCK,

OK, we have argued all winter on the board about who the Orioles could have spent some money{or prospects}on that would have improved the team. It's over now, and it is what it is

I know we don't have a crystal ball but for the sake of conjecture let's assume that the Orioles starting pitching holds it's own and does not wear down the bullpen and we avoid the second half collapse. That should equate to 74 to 80 wins. A lot of ifs to be sure including Garrett Atkins but let's say thats how it plays out.

Who would you, jim66, Not Brooks, Cush and others think that the Orioles should go after next year in order to make a run for the pennant in 2011. I think we all agree that should be the goal, rebuilding 90% complete by that time. Who do we try to sign and do you really think Angelos and Macphail will open the checkbook at that time?

Please don't infer that it was never about 2011 or Wayne is going to own this thread.

obviously 5 believers=bf=SHAMROCK=ken

MacFail has had 3 offeseasons and nothing, nada, zilch

I thought when he came on board in 07, we would be at .500 in 09 and contending in 2010?

Wasnt that the plan?

The plan is tomorrow never comes

I think that by this time next year, there will be a lot more unanimity on the board. If the youth doesn't pan out, and/or no major free agent is added, I think that everyone will agree with wayne.

If the youth pans out and a major free agent or two is added, I like to think that Wayne will be supportive and positive.

In any event, by this time next year there better be significant and visible results of the plan or AM will have no support on this blog.

Just skimmed over the past couple dozen posts...

Did someone really say that the Giants are willing to spend to put a winning team on the field and use Aubrey Huff as their example?

I dunno European Prof, I was signed by the warehouse for 5 years with and mutual option on the 6th year.

I think that means I'm drinking Kool-Aid till 2014...

nb,

Your a #'s guy, as well as pretty neutral about the O's.

How would you explain those defending AM's horrid record since 1993? No back to back winning seasons, an average of 74 wins per year.

Yes, he did win 2 rings, but what were the payrolls top to bottom on in 1990, 2000 and 2010? Logic suggest the game, on the major league level, has passed him by.

But since you're the most balanced numbers guy posting, I thought you'd take a stab at this..... I'm not talking about his ability to improve the the minors within an organization mind you. I'm talking specifically about his inability to put together a major league roster.

Gil,

Did you know that in the last ten years, AM's win total has been in the 60's seven times?

This is the guru this town is falling all over themselves about?

No Wayne,

I did not know the actual numbers. People change sometimes, but I can only judge him buy what I see and what he has done since he got here. Those things may be germaine and may reflect the record that you cited.

I see a skilled individual when it comes to dumping expensive and sometimes underperforming veterens contracts, in turn for young but unproven talent. That may be his strength.

On the other hand I see an indecisive haggler when it comes to an aggressive posture towards acquiring outstanding talent from other clubs in order to get the team in a position to compete... without having to wait an uncertain number of years for the acquired prospects to coalesce into a potential contender.

It seems that the latter part of Macphail's skills as a Baseball executive have been more manifest to me, and until he proves otherwise it may be that it will take a new GM to take the next step.

Well said Gil,

To be fair, I'll even throw out his first year in Baltimore. Doing so however, simply doesn't help his case.

There are some execs suited for bettering the system (below the majors). Then there are those who understand how to put a winning major league team on the field, especially during an era when mixing youth with veterans is a constant challenge.

I was mainly going by all the Chicago press clippings through the years when determining this guy wasn't all that. Having seen his record over the past 16 years though, it's absolutely startling!

It really is a helpless feeling Gil!

Wayne,

the joke may be on people like us who thought Macphail was brought here to Rebuild the fram system and simultaneously try to put a winning team on the field. It may very well be that the agreement between Angelos and Macphail doesn't involve anything more than the farm system deal. Angelos and Macphail may declare phase one over and that Macphail's job is complete within the next two years. Macphail may very likely move on before he ever acquires his first marquee player from another organization.

If that is the"Plan" then we have been had.

Gil,

It really is a helpless feeling! People call me negative, and I am when it comes to this team. Now though, it just feels hopeless!

Oh well, I hope the SB is a great game at least!

The kool aiders dont believe what they are saying. Deep down they know that they are full of it. They just lack the maturity to admit that they are dead wrong

wayne -

It's hard to ignore Andy's success in Minnesota. Of course, as it's been said several times, the business of the game is drastically different now than it was 15 years ago.

Chicago's a difficult case, and I don't feel qualified to write much about it, as I have no idea what Andy's role was after Jim Hendry was promoted to GM in 2002. The relationship there seems just as complicated as the Flanagan/Beattie era was in Baltimore.

All of that said, it's obvious that Andy has never been a big free agent guy. He did sign Jack Morris in 1991, but past that, I can't think of anything off the top of my head.

In the end, I'll continue to dream about Adrian Gonzalez and Josh Beckett. I know the track record isn't there with Andy, but I won't judge the future until it happens.

I just Ignore any evidence that doesnt support my position

If someone answers a question I asked,but I dont like the answer. I ignore the answer and keep asking it like it was never answered. No one is paying that close attention anyway

did someone ask how many World Series Titles AM has won?
Oh, it's 2 thanks for asking.

Did someone ask what has happened since his last series ?

Oh yeah, its been horrific

7 of 10 seasons with 90 or more losses, the preceding 8 seasons werent much better

Sorry guys I got nothing good to day post 1991.........oops

Guess Im not a very good ambassador for dad... i mean andy

Who cares if we win or not ?

Whats the BFD ?

James C

Yes , I would also consider Zito signing a bust , my point is you can SIGN free agents AND rebuild your prospects at SAME time . Yes , Linecum is their best player ( they hit on him from draft ) . There are several players on that were free agents ( mostly bats ) that also helped them win .
If you think O's and MacCheap should avoid free agency like a plague , then how do you explain Yankees signings Teixeria , Sabathia and Burnett , all of whom , took them to their World Series win ?

It was always a 3-4 year process. When "rebuilding" plans became the thing back in the 90's, it was usually a 5 year plan. Then due to ownership pressures, things would get rushed and never get done right.

No one claimed it would happen over night. The O's will not permanently rebuild like the Royals. Indians, A's, Marlins or Pirates who dump their best talent because of financial problems.

Id like to think AM is doing it right. He took the team to the mat and is building them back up. The promising talent is much more talented than the hacks from the past 12 years (no more Matos, Bigbie, Cabrera).

The Indians were in the AL championship 2 yrs ago and are usually competitive

Andy hasnt been competitive in a long time

Your 5 yr rebuilding number is made up, who uses 5 yrs as a barometer?

Andy is too afraid to give any timetable because he knows hes never gonna produce a winner, but wins dont really matter do they ? its all about the perpetual future

hey,

shamrock, obviously 5 believers and bill are always around at the same time

coincidence?

I think not

This organization was such an unmitigated disaster not so very long ago, I would not have considered a ten-year timetable to be unreasonable in getting it fixed, especially considering that it must be fixed in the AL East..

Now, in Year-04, we are putting a high quality, young pitching staff on the mound - both starters abd relievers - and surrounding them with four or five high-quality, young position players as well as a possible couple of others next season.

Best of all, we have turned the minor league system into one that is starting to churn them out on a regular basis via quality drafting.

We didn't get into this mess overnight and it gets old seeing people gripe about how it is taking over five minutes to get us out of it.

We're still looking at another two ot three years at the very least, people. So sit back, relax, and watch it happen.

any yet we will be lucky to finish in 4th place with 75 wins

and with our fearless leader's inability to exploit the free agent market, our only hope of further improvement most come from within, unfortunately, we have no positional prospects to rely on

sure bell and snyder are hyped, but neither of them has produced a AAA yet

If we dont use free agency and there is no one in the minors, how are we supposed to make the jump from75 to 95 wins to ever make the postseason ?

whats the BFD guys ?

its already been 12 straight losing seasons

Its not like 4 more yrs of losing is gonna kill anybody

man,,some people are so impatient

wayne

did you notice a warehouser named fang guy is already claiming its really about 2013 or 2014 anyway. ?

You cant make this up

Fang Guy

That may be the best post, from 'that side', I've ever seen.

Of course teams take '10 years' to turn things around (see all of us negative morons hitting ourselves upside the head).

Of course it take more than 'five minutes' (now we're slapping ourselves in the face).

Of course 'We're still looking at another two or three years' (stop it - this self beating really hurts).

Just for fun, I'm going to look for some of those press clipping from Chicago. If I'm not mistaking, I remember reading the same exact things.

Damn, and where are those quotes from MacPhail admitting that he completely failed.

No matter though Fang Guy, even though MacPhail has one of the worst executive records in baseball over the past 16 years, and even though guys like bergesen, reimold, weiters, brob johnson and markakis, etc are from the previous disastrous regime...... we'll wait! I mean you're only talking 2012, 13 or longer. No problem, we'll wait!

Great Post!

Hey guys

RELAX .

All rebuilding efforts take at least 7 yrs especially after a team hasnt won for a decade. Watch ouf for the O's in 2014. Im not kidding

Look at the Pirates, you dont have a 20 yr losing streak by rushing all through the rebuilding stage

That was Andy's problem in Chicago, he was only given 12 yrs to turn them around.

Obviously, he wasnt given enough time to do the job. Pffftt

Ok, It's time!

You did a great job making your point about people using different names. I think it's time to go back to your one name now.

Let the warehousers use different names. It's obvious who they are, and I just think it's funny (because they actually thinking they're fooling people).

But maybe don't stoop to their level anymore? It really makes posting not as enjoyable when names are completely bogus all the time.

Just my opinion and only a suggestion, but you made your point. There are some really good posters here (actually on both sides), and it would be cool to go back.

I remember reading on this blog last yr and people were citing andy's record in chicago as proof that he was the right man for the job

did those people bother to look up his record ?

now those same people are saying that what he did in chicago didnt matter

So if his record is good, its proof hes the right man for the job, but if his record is bad then his record doesnt matter anyway

Andy cant lose--- in this blog. On the field, hes very good at losing

I like going by bill, bf, SHAMROCK, paulie, obviously 5 believers and .. oh nevermind I cant keep up myself

Like I said earlier, who cares if I change my name all of the time--Its just a blog

Seriously people, can't we all learn to get along? We're both using the same tired arguments over and over and over again. I say enough already! Yes, wayne, we know you're negative and have nothing new to say. And everyone else, don't let wayne or Gil get under your skin. There are much better things to worry about.

This blog isn't even fun anymore because everyone is arguing incessantly, especially about things that have nothing to do with Pete's post. Where does this stem from? Honestly, wayne, I see this mostly stems from your wildly off-topic criticism that you somehow claim relates to the post. Wow.

I just think everyone needs to take a step back and think, hey, I'm wasting my time arguing over the little things. There are much more important things to worry about in the world.

I know this comment will probably be ignored, but I'm just putting it out there.

Yeah, cut it out

I change names all of the time to make it look like people agree with me, you're just doing it to prove how preposterous some of the excuses are

You're ruining doppleganging for the rest of us, damn it

Its cute that when the apologists run out of excuses, they resort to the ol' theres more important things to worry about and stop being so "negative"

Never heard that one before. Thats about as original as rebuilding takes 7 yrs

I think its kinda of funny

I'm not an "apologist," whoever you are. I'm a fan, and I'd like to enjoy the blog without name-calling and childish excuses like, "changing names" blah blah blah.

It's just so dumb. What are you, 5?

Youre an apologist because you never call out other apologists. Apologists never admit that they are apologists either

bill/bf/SHAMROCK/paulie/jim66/obviously 5 believers call more names than anyone on here and he started multi-personaiity blog syndrome, yet you've never been compelled to call him out

Thus, you're an apologist.

The first step is admitting it

I think the back and forth is entertaining.

The bickering on here is a little funnier than on the sun boards.They really go at it over there, you should check it out

I said I didn't like it when anyone calls anyone names. Maybe if you read you'd know that. I'm not going to argue with you, OK? That's pointless.

Ilana,

Funny, Ive never seen you call anyone else out for name calling.

Seriously, apologists call names more than anyone, yet Ive never seen them confronted about it? Strange

You could just be another incantation of bill/shamrock/obviously 5 believer when you selectively decide when name calling bothers you

Be consistent or STFU

Have a nice day

SHAMROCK,

I think most of us would agree that Macphail's work rebuilding the farm sysytem has been a spectacular success. I also concur that the landscape has changed drastically as to how excactly a major league club can be rebuilt. It seems that Macphail is rebuilding from the bottom up only, and that may be his charge from Angelos. Andy Macphail may step down before he ever attempts to acquire marquee talent. He may not be comfortable with that phase of headache and haggling.

Since most of us agree that the team must be able to contend by 2011, what players would you go after to get the team in a position to make a run for the pennant next year?

I have asked this question to the Macphail proponents on numerous occasions and there is silence. That tells me that even his staunchest supporters are reticent about Macphail when it comes to going outside the organization for marquee talent.

A brief history of the macphail era

2007 - "evaluations" of the organization

2008- Bedard/Tejada Trades

2009- Prolonged vacation to Barbados & Antigua during the offseason

Promises to "buy the bats"

Bypasses the likes of P Matzek (3.9 mil signing bonus) SS Grant Green (2.9 mil) for Matt Hobgood (2.2 mill) in draft

Proclaims that "2010 is about wins and losses" and that he'll get DT everything he needs to compete

2010- Stopgaps, retreads and reclamations bats are acquired along with a mediocre innings eater as a cheaper sub for an ace

on the INtl front:
1b Chapman signs with Cincy
SS sano sign with MN

Countdown for 2013, the real target yr to compete is spoken of often whenever the 2010 teams shortcomings are scrutinized

"Seriously, apologists call names more than anyone, yet Ive never seen them confronted about it? Strange"

apologists. yeah, that's not name calling.

thanks again black kettle.

llana,

First of all, I don't call people names. I should, but I don't!

Second, I believe the post go off subject because Pete has been putting so few subjects out there.

I mean how many times can one talk about Mora or Bedard?

Or how about this subject... 'Snow Day', especially when he mentions Hendrickson?

I told Pete that he needs spring training, and fast. He needs SOMETHING to write about, even if the O's give him nothing interesting.

Losing does this llana! And the losing will continue this year. AM's record over the last 16 years is worse than most ever realized.

That's why you see Blogs end up like this....

paulie=bf=obviously5=jim66=shamrock

Hypocrisy (if that's your real name),

I think it's clear which side you're on - I see plenty of name calling from both sides. I consider myself pretty neutral (yes, I'm frustrated, but I don't have enough energy to be as jaded as some) and I get annoyed at the amount of crap spewing from both sides. It's just like Congress - you stick by your side for better or worse, and the other side is evil even if they might actually have a good idea.

Wayne,

I'm with you on spring training - it needed to start yesterday. There's so little going on and most of us have cabin fever, so it's going to be vicious until we (and Pete) can find something more constructive to talk about. I need a box score as bad as I need a snow blower right now.

Spring training, take me away!

I agree with you that its like politics. No matter how much evidence is produced, the macfailers wont admit that hes not good at producing winners at the ML level in the past couple of decades

Rather than admit as much, they are now lowered to completely fabricating excuses for MacPhail. The only budget constraints he had were self imposed.

Its not a coincidence that Cubs payroll rose significantly with his departure (so did win totals)

AM was criticized In Cubsdom for not exploiting resources, sound familiar?

now the macfailers are making up lies about him being hamstrung. I cant stand apologists, but a liar is much worse

Just like a republican will never admit that bush was an idiot or (insert democrat example here), an apologist wont admit that AM is overmatched and obsolete

The so called "negatives" credit AM for his success with the minors, why cant the koolaiders admit his shortcomings in the majors ?

I think that there is a definite generational disconnect here with the youngins just not aware of what they're missing with winning baseball