If you make to Portland, make sure to grab some food and beer at one of the many McMenamins pubs. And then get a No Name at Voodoo Doughnut for desert.

We wouldn't enjoy it without you here Pete.
Thankfully your not trying to tell us that these moves are what the O's need to do to return to prominence in the AL East like one of your colleagues wrote today.
Nice low risk moves perhaps, but hardly enough to change the competitive balance in the division. I'm still waiting to see a big time deal to get an impact player. I think what Andy has done so far is just fine, but it's not enough to do anything more than make the O's a little better. Perhaps, with the expected improvement of the rookies, these moves may get the Orioles to within spitting distance of .500, but nobody should be foolish enough to believe that the O's are now suddenly competitive in any real sense of the word.
If Andy can find us a genuine threat for the middle of the lineup, then I'll head into spring at least thinking they can become a team that the rest of the division at least has to think about a little. As little as that is, if he brings us 81 wins I'll be content with that for 2010.
So far so good Andy, but it's not enough yet.

You say that this coming season the O's will have a better chance game-to-game, especially if McTurtle can land one MORE(!) corner infielder. I'd change that to read "IF the O's can land TWO corner infielders with power. I don't think they have landed EVEN ONE!
CLIFF LEE for 3 MINOR LEAGUERS!
Now that's the kind of deal we fans would like to see McTurtle make. Think that will EVER be possible?
Mora at third would be a better power bet in '10 than Atkins and so far Scott is the 1st baseman.
Say, Pete, what's the word on Moore? Is he out of the major league picture?

I think that Jason Bay would be a better fit for the Orioles than Matt Holliday because he is more suited to hit cleanup than the other guy. Also, he is a better high fastball hitter and the O's don't have many of those. And he'd be less expensive - a mere $ 70 million for four years could bring him here.

The 2010 Orioles are not fit to play in the AL East. They should be sent down to the minors until Angelos dies.

Stay in Oregon.

Are the Orioles going to move to Portland??!

With Holliday not happening and if the Os aren't going to or can't pull the trigger on an A-Gon trade, take a serious look Delgado...the guys an on base/rbi machine. Yep, on the downside, but even last year the guy drove in 23 runs in 26 games...hitting behind Roberts/Reimold/Nick he'd drive in 115. High OBP leads one to believe the pitchers think there's still something to be scared of. An Atkins type offer for more money?

Why on Earth do you people want Delgado?? He is just more of the same old BS around here!

Please no Holliday. He seems like a nice guy and a solid ball player but do not the Orioles have a solid, young, affordable outfield?

Holliday would not make the O's a contender but Adrian Gonzales would. They would go from having nobody at 1B to a 45+ HR machine (and who does not believe HR production would jump 10% with the porch in RF) ?

What would the O's have to give up to get him? I'm sure plenty but I'm also confident that an O's team with him would compete for a Wild Card in 2010.

Dan -

Contention at any point in the future depends on starting pitching.

The O's could get Gonzalez and Holliday, but if the young pitchers don't step up and they don't add a legit top of the rotation guy next winter, they'll just be like the Texas teams from the late 90's and early 00's.

We need A-Gon. We do not have a big bat that opposing pitchers fear. Our lineup will be mowed down again.

We need A-Gon. We need A-Gon. We need A-Gon.

I always enjoy the comments as much as the blog. It sure is a tough crowd here and I thought Tiny Tim was tough when he wrote that Santa was not going to be involved in Christmas this year because he didn't want to give the Aids to the reindeer. Anyway, Peter, hope you're having fun! Bay would be nice though.

Pete,

I agree that we havent "closed the gap" between ourselves the Evil Empire and the Red Sux and we are still a little behind the D-Rays and probably about on the same plane as the Boo Jays but I think if this team comes out and plays as exciting as Gonzalez pitches it could be a descent year. I really just want to see this team have some fight and go down swinging!!

Nice moves by the FO...now it's time to get serious... Sign Holliday, then Trade Pie, Scott, Snyder, and Arrieta or Erbe to SD for Gonzalez...

Gives us a line-up of :
Roberts
Jones
Markakis
Holliday
AGonzalez
Wieters
Reimold
Atkins
Izturis

I think we would be able to make a significant move up the standings with that line-up...

True words, Pete. We are one more BIG bat away from being competitive for third place in the AL Beast and possibly a winning season. It ain't great but I will take that for 2010. Even a puncher's chance is better than being just a punching bag.

True words, Pete. We are one more BIG bat away from being competitive for third place in the AL Beast and possibly a winning season. It ain't great but I will take that for 2010. Even a puncher's chance is better than being just a punching bag.

Sell high on Reimold and package him w Arieta, Snyder and Hernandez if SD won;t except Pie, Arieta, Snyder, Hernandez. Adding Reimold would give them a power bat to replace A Gon, a potential 1st baseman a yr away with power bat, a qulaity, young starting pitcher for now and a hometown supr stud a year away from the bigs. WE get a legitimate major league lineup! WIN-WIN.

If the birds get delgado i am going to puke

Why would the Orioles pick up Delgado after going to the extremes to rid themselves of Huff and Mora?? They need to either start a rookie with skill or go after A-Gon.

Those hard hitting Texas Ranger teams made the playoffs.

It is too expensive and risky to buy pitching - just look at how much money the Yankees have burned through. Better for the Orioles to spend big on one young power hitter and hope the quality pitching develops.

One of our few strong areas is the outfield so why spend such huge $$$ for a guy like Holliday? I'd rather see us make a deal for a premier 1B like Cabrera or Gonzalez even if it means trading a pitcher or 2, along with a few others.
These big sluggers don't come along every year so this is a prime time to make a deal.

The Orioles BS is legendary! Why do they refuse to compete year after year? Is actually playing to win not cost effective enough for these jerks?!

Why would the Orioles pick up Delgado after going to the extremes to rid themselves of Huff and Mora??

Because whoever signs Delgado is going to sign him to a short term, incentive laden deal that will only get remotely expensive if he produces.

And because from '05 to '08, before he got hurt, Delgado averaged 33 homers and a .523 slg%.

Mora averaged 18 homers and a .427 slg% from '05 to '09. Huff, in that same span, averaged 21 homers and a .456 slg%. There's really no comparison.

No one is saying that Delgado's a sure thing to hit 30 homers, and he won't be paid as such. But he's still a legitimate power threat if he's healthy and, therefor, he's worth the risk.

Man, you are exactly right, picking up Delgado is not a good idea. There is more risk to him than upside potential. What happened to Michael Aubery? Couldn't he fit in a first? Personally, I would really like to see Andy and the boys target Kouzmanoff. That is who we really need.

With all due respect Steven, after 12 years, aren't you tired of seeing the Orioles go down swinging? I want the team to have some fight and COME OUT WINNING!

Not Brooks,

oh boy.. take your meds again bro.. Delgado is old, bad in the clubhouse and a loser. He was a big part of those Met Freefalls. No thanks we need youth and skill here.

Okay if I had to pick a washup like Delgado out there I would have to say mike lowell. That deal with Texas isnt final yet and the guy is a winner.

Mike Lowell looks like a pedo and we dont need anymore of them here in Maryland thats for sure...

Seth -

How was Delgado a "major part of those Met Freefalls"?

In Sept/Oct 2007, he hit .321/.383/.566 with four homers and 10 rbi.

In Sept/Oct 2008, he mashed to the tune of .340/.400/.649 with eight homers and 22 rbi.

And I bet the only reason you think he's "bad in the clubhouse" is because he didn't stand up for the National Anthem a couple of years ago.

In reality, Delgado has always been well-liked in the clubhouse, gives a ton of money and support to charities and has been nominated for the Roberto Clemente Award (which goes to the player in baseball who best exemplifies humanitarianism and sportsmanship) several times, winning it in 2006.

First choice is a trade for A-Gon, Cabrera, Fielder but they don't look like they're happening (who really knows?) You're not going to be able to find 25 choir boys...Delgado isn't the long term answer but he will drive in 115 runs hitting cleanup for the Os with Roberts, Reimold, and Markakis in front of him. Put Weiters, Jones, and Atkins behind him and that's a nice lineup, especially if they learn a little patience (where's Axl when we need him?) The guy falls out of bed and knocks in a run. If he's still hurt or the injury has affected him, don't sign him. Hmmm, Delgado or Aubrey? Cleanup hitter or 8th place hitter? CD will knock in more runs next year than Mora and Huff combined hitting cleanup for this club.

Found this, kinda sucks but its an award the Os didn't want to win:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=caple_jim&id=4750589

Remember all the hype/hope when we signed Wigginton? Good 3B, versatile, will hit with power. And what did he do 1st half last year? Nothing.

I say this only because we get excited when we sign someone with a glimmer of possible upside. Until our young players truly develop, we can sign all the FA's on the market and we won't compete. There's a reason these FA's fall to the O's.

not brooks:

I can back up your assertion that Delgado is not a clubhouse problem. He certainly wasn't when he was up here playing for the Blue Jays. Sometimes when a guy is like that you don't hear about it until after he leaves and nothing bad was said about him even after he did.

why can't the Orioles go after Holliday or Gonzalez? I am tired of BS signings, give the fans something to get excited about and maybe it will be this sorry attendance and give this team a chance at .500. I am sick of hearing all the bulls*it. if this organization wants to win, they have to open up their wallet a little bit.

I wonder how many of the posters out there think the O's could be a .500 team if they were in the AL Central, or better yet, the NL Central? What's my point?

My point is that the O's are becoming a more competitive team with one major disadvantage, they are in the AL East. Remember, a .500 record in September in the NL puts you right in the Wild Card race (or NL Central race)almost every year.

Again, my point is to keep things in perspective, we will never outspend the Yankees (last done by Angelos in the mid-90's), so I like our plan of growning the young talent to become competitive for several years, not just for short bursts.

Check out this info on the birds signings!

http://fortheloveofthegamelifeasasportsfan.blogspot.com/2009/12/baltimore-free-agent-frenzy-continues.html

jim -

According to Tim Brown, the O's have an offer out to Holliday: "Hearing Holliday has another legit offer beyond Cards and O's, from an East Coast team. Boras response: 'Matt has multiple offers.'" (Source: Brown's Twitter page)

And according to Gordon Edes, MacPhail was kicking the tires on an Adrian Gonzalez trade at the Winter Meetings: "Boston won't be only team on [Adrian] Gonzalez. Baltimore made a pretty good run at him at the winter meetings, I'm told" (Source: Edes' Twitter page)

Embarrassing!

A scrap heep corner you lost his job (insert reason here)in colorado where stats are inflated..... And a closer who has 10 saves last year and is currently unproven in the role.

More competitive Pete? Are you doing serious journalism here or are you pulling our legs?

Why would this team win more than 64 games? Oh, right...... it's about 2011. I keep forgetting.

The warehouse employed positive bloggers need to just back off for a while. You're embarrassing yourselves with positive spin about junk.

And the (we can't do without their advertising dollars) media have to stop giving the warehouse a pass time and time again.

Demand better.... raise the bar (everyone). Otherwise, you're just embarrassing yourselves.

BirdsFan2110 -

Is that your blog?

If so, you should know that Rafael Soriano was traded to the Rays a week ago.

Not Brooks, I'm with you. I think Delgado would be a great signing for where we are in the rebuilding. One year with incentives for Delgado, and give Brandon Snyder time to see if he'll pan out. Right now, no one on the O's is even guaranteed to hit 25 HR. Barring a grand injury, what's to stop Delgado from doing that?

When it comes to Delgado's clubhouse personality, I think people are making FAR MORE of a fuss about this patriotism controversy, which, in my mind, is bollocks. We don't pay players to grab the microphone and sing to the flag. We pay them to play baseball and play it well, and Delgado is a gamer. I wish people would let baseball be a game rather than one more opportunistic political witch hunt.

Ooh. I'll have to upgrade my prediction of a 77-85 prediction.

80-82

Wayne the ignorant said
More competitive Pete? Are you doing serious journalism here or are you pulling our legs?
~~~~~~

I do not recall Peter as a journalist tho he probably was employed as one at some time in his career. I know him as columnist and blogger. There is a difference. Add the media to baseball on the list of things about which Wayne knows nothing and yet sounds off on ignorantly.

I love when Wayne states a fact (10 saves) throws in his opinion stated as a fact (unproven, scrap heep, most of us say heap but, oh well) and then spins this web of no substance into some dire sounding prophecy of doom (will win 64 games). IF I thought he was capable of learning anything I might point out that Sherrill was not a proven closer when the O's made him one nor was the Eck proven as a closer when he was made one. But as he would just prefer to go through life terminally ignorant, why bother trying to educate the boy?

Just how insecure is the group of posters who so cant believe that someone disagrees with their opinion that they prefer to conjure up a vast media conspiracy??!!

Seems like a good time to segue into "Please at this holiday season remember those wretches less fortunate than yourselves."

I know this is probably just a pipe dream, but I have to admit I am excited about the possiblilities of this happening!

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/121409-Latest-MLB-buzz

I know this is probably just a pipe dream, but I have to admit I am excited about the possibility of this happening!

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/121409-Latest-MLB-buzz

"attempt to close the competitive gap with the Yankees and Red Sox."

What about Tornoto and Tampa Bay? The Orioles were a last place team.

That's Toronto. oops

Anom,

Seriously? That's your argument?

I am guilty of saying journalist instead of columnist. FIne! How about getting the point though?

Going into last year, Sherril had better credentials as a closer, and Mora had better credentials at 3rd. Mora struggled, while Sherill was a stud. With both however, we could expect good years.

Atkins is an improvement? And we now have a better closer?

You define the typical planted O's blogger. You can't back anything you say with real stats. Instead you throw out typical oriole spin.

Just tired of the constant bullshit!

To be clear,

Gonzalez isn't a terrible pick up. He may turn into something and at worse will improve a dreadful overall pen. For a team like this, he'll likely not kill them.

Atkins however is indefensible. Shame on you Pete, and anyone else who believes this is forward thinking or a sign that this club is serious about putting a respectable team on the field. Shame on you!

The orioles have some players (and I don't have to run the names off like some like to do). They don't come close to having a team however, thus why they repeatedly are one of the worst teams in baseball year in and year out.

Does that sentence matter to anyone? The one that says 'one of the worst teams in baseball year in and year out'?

Atkins? Shame on this organization!

Wayne-
What's your plan to make the Orioles competitive?

Wayne, you are a vile and disgusting human being, and it is unlikely that anyone in your life (family included, even the one that spit you out) can palate the stench of your oily hide long enough to tell you - yet again - to please, PLEASE go away. Anywhere... anywhere else. You don't have to be pulled apart by horses, eaten alive by rogue chimpanzees, or subjected to various other ingenious tortures that involve deceptively vicious mammals, but just go away. Clamp that stinking pit of rancid meat in your face and find something better to do with your time than to ruin the lives of the readers of this blog, and those of humanity at large. Toodles.

Esskay,

That was classic.... Put that kind of passion into holding the warehouse accountable though, then we're getting somewhere.

Hit a nerve by the way? It's hard to admit the o's plant positive bloggers? Maybe even you perhaps? I love it1

Keep the passion.... ask for a winner you all beef dude

...You define the typical planted O's blogger.... Posted by: wayne

Do you have some names to back this up? Or is it another mysterious Wayne's in the know because Angelos' 4th cousin said something to me I can't repeat at a location I can't reveal situation? It's easy to make things up when you never back them up with facts. It's easy to say what a stupid signing, what are they thinking, kool aid blah blah blah etc. etc. when you don't back it up with your grand plan. For someone who hates the team so much, you sure do visit these blogs alot. Quit acting like a child and suck it up when the team doesn't sign who you want. If you disagree, fine. But other people post something positive, wonder about who they should sign or trade for and what it would take, and you can only act 15, call names and be the in the know insider. So what's your grand plan, general manager? Put it out there and shut all of us fools down. Show us your ability to build this franchise into a dynasty. I'll bet my paycheck you don't, just like when I asked you the other five times.

The goal is to get the consecutive losing streak monkey off their backs. Being competitive is not a priority. Maybe next year, maybe not. It all depends on how Matusz, Tillamn, Wieters, Jones pan out. If the O's luck out and these guys all gel, it will be interesting to see if the O's try to take it to the next level. I'm not going to many games until it's clear that making the playoffs, not just winning 81 games, is the goal.

Pete, have you heard if the O's have any interest in Ryan Garko? he seems like he would be a nice fit at 1B with Atkins at 3B.

The Os cannot, CANNOT let the Red Sox acquire Adrian Gonzalez. He fills our need for an everyday 1B and our need for a true cleanup hitter. Imagine the #s Jones and Markakis put up w/ him protecting them. I would offer a big time package, something like Pie or Reimold(their choice), Arrieta, Brandon Snyder, and 1 or 2 more decent pitching prospects. I might even offer both Pie and Reimold if they'd let us keep Snyder.

And then I'd sign Matt Holliday. Heh.

Ya never know...Santa MIGHT be listening...

Guru,

I won't write a book. Instead I'll just say look at St Louis. Same size market, but with a team that builds youth while spending like they should.

They know they can't spend like NY or Boston, but they spend according to their market size.......something the O's refuse to do.

Their fans and media always (i mean always) demand the best and hold management accountable at every turn.
Baltimore fans and media do not!

No, they don't make the playoffs every year. They don't have to however, as they're always competitive......and respectful to their fans.

To me, they're the model for markets the size of baltimore. The names of the players don't matter as it's all about having a consistent, real plan in place.

And Guru,

You seriously want names of oriole bloggers? Come on dude, wake up! Who in the hell said I knew their names? If I did, you think I'd tell you? I never said it was their fault anyway. It's a paycheck.... pays the bills, thus not their fault.

Like usual though, you missed the point. No worries..... Go Atkins!

It seems like the Orioles have a plan for the first time in 10 years. The same plan that St. Louis has. The same plan you have been crying about for two weeks. They are building the farm system. They signed a player off a bad year for cheap to hold down the position until the youth movement can continue. They signed a reliever with closing experience with a proven track record. They are trying to sign Holliday, offering 16 or 18 million a year. They tried to sign Tex last year, offered him 150 million if I remember correctly. They can't be forced to sign here. As stated, the Orioles' model St. Louis can't spend like the Yankees or Red Sox, and neither can the Orioles. So if the Yankees sign Tex for 180 miliion, and if they or the Red Sox or whoever sign Holliday/Bay/LaRoche for more than the team can offer, what then? More complaints? More warehouse conspiracy theories? If the team trades the farm for Gonzalez, how does that figure into the St. Louis plan? Killing the farm system that JUST RECENTLY got replenished for a player, while an all star gold glover who would kill while here, who will go to the Red Sox or another big market in two years? How do any of the arguments you've been making fit into the basic outline you've laid out?

Yea, Guru, what he said.

Because, you know, you're not a real fan unless you come on here and spew the same tired lines over and over, attacking the front office and anyone on the blog who disagrees with you.

If you can't get angry, negative, and borderline irrational at the operations of your (supposed) favorite baseball team, I mean, seriously, what's the point in living?

Wayne,

You may be a little rough around the edges, but why not? You're going against the most positive group of bloggers I've ever seen. One would think that Balt has been a winner for years by the way most blogs read.

I just don't get it? How are the Orioles better now than this time last year? Is everyone really banking on all the young starters coming together? Hell, there's a good chance most won't even make it through the year. And who are the # 4 and 5 hitters on this team?

I'm not sure I buy that the Orioles plant bloggers, but when you really think about it, it could explain what we're seeing. It certainly makes one think.

This team is just awful. I predict the Orioles will be worse than the Nats in 2010. It actually seems obvious.

Wayne, don't be so dense while saying someone else is missing the point. It makes you look worse than you already do.The names they have been using on this blog, not their real names. Before you try to use it as an escape route, I know you can change your name on here. Maybe point to a specific example, instead of speaking in generalities for once.

Hey guys,

You just have nothing on your side, Nothing accept losing and bad signings!

And oh yeah..... more losing!

Guru, you sound like you work for the O's public relations office. I'm not saying you do... just that you sound like it. It's truly ridiculous!

You justify every non signing, every non trade and you glorify every move the Orioles make. It really is hard to explain.

And JeffChill, that was brilliant!

PetesBeef, I agree that the Nats will be better. SIgnificantly better in fact!

Just have some pride positive bloggers. Ask for a team that will have a shot at 81 wins. If all else fails, please just try a different spin!

Seems like I'm the only one who likes the moves that are being made. Why over spend for Holiday when we already have a log jam in the outfield ? Why trade pitching prospects for A GON when we have Snyder that's should be ready soon ? Don't forget we have Bell waiting in the wings as well. I moved to Tampa in 05 and I seen how the Rays turned into a contender. They did not make one Blockbuster deal to get it done. They did it with their young kids that toom some time to jell. Rome was not built in a day, remember we are not trying to build a one and done team. I don't know about you but I want a DYNASTY ! I go to every game when the O's come here to Tampa and will continue to support them. GO O'S !!

Guru, you sound like you work for the O's public relations office. I'm not saying you do... just that you sound like it. It's truly ridiculous!

It's all a grand conspiracy. All of us work for the Orioles except (or is it accept?) you, Wayne. Even the people on your side are only setting you up for later. Now that you've broken the news to everyone who just reads and doesn't post, I can be a True Orioles Fan like you. I hate McFail! He's a loser who only signs retreads! Angelos is a greedy man who's only interested in his bank account! Atkins sucks! Gonzalez is a scrub! Millwood should be in the minors! WOW, I really feel better now that I can be negative at every turn.

CJ, I'm outing you as a warehouse plant. Nothing positive about the Orioles can ever be posted on this blog again. Wayne has broken our grand conspiracy. Let's move on to the Ravens blogs and spin the 7-6 record into super bowl contention.

AM signs retreads, Angelos only inerested in bank account, Atkins sucks....... check, check and check!

Gonzales a scrub (nope, just an unproven closer). Millwood should be in the minors (nope, just stated that his awful 07 and 08 stats are true indicators).

All in all, not bad Guru! Here's two more though: 64 loses in 09' - check! 13th losing season in a row coming up - check!

lol Guru,

Nope, no planters on the Ravens side. That's an organization with class. They don't lie to the fans or intimidate the media.

Never said all positive posters were planters Guru. You're sure sounding defensive these days though. Interesting!

Gets some rest! Lots of positive spin to get to tomorrow!

Never said all positive posters were planters Guru. You're sure sounding defensive these days though. Interesting!

Never gave a --->posted Not interesting!

Let's try this again, since the blog decided to post whatever that was...

You never gave a 'posted' name of the supposed plants, either.
You're sure sounding like a broken record these days.
Not interesting!

Pete,

I'm surprised there hasn't been a hint of the O's (or anyone else for that matter) looking at Vlad Guerrero. It seems to me he would add a very professional and still intimidating bat to the DH spot. This would take some pressure off youung hitters like Weiters and Reimold, not to mention Markakis and you would think it would only take a 2 year commitment. Vlad is aging and can't give you much time in the field, but as we saw in post season, he can still hit.

Mr. Schmuck:

I'm disappointed to come and read your latest post, only to be hit with such negativity. You make the comment that the O's have done nothing to close the competitive gap between themselves and the Yanks/Sox, and in the very next breath say that the O's have made themselves more competitive. How can both statements be true?

I think that the Yankees have gone sideways at best and perhaps backwards with the Granderson deal. The Sox have gotten better in the short-term with the Lackey and Cameron signings, but in the long run I think that both deals hurt. I think that the Lackey deal in particular will mess up their finances where it concerns both Lester and Beckett.

The Orioles are better than Toronto now, and perhaps better than Tampa Bay now. The best thing that the O's can acquire right now is time. I think the Orioles will be a significantly better team this year if for no other reason than the four rookie starters will have experience. I think that Matusz is the leading candidate for AL ROY. Call me a kool-aid drinker if you wish. I just don't recall you being as cynical as your articles in recent times indicate you have become.

Better than Toronto and Tampa?

See...... Just what I'm talking about!

As for not being interesting Guru... I'm not attempting to be. Are you?

You really need to wake up and smell the losing dude!

72 comments, 48 of them either by or about wayne.too funny.
dude.

STAY IN THE GREAT NORTHWEST. THAT WOULD BE A MAJOR IMPROVEMENT TO THE QUALITY, TALENT AND INTELLIGENCE TO THE SUN'S SPORTS REPORTING STAFF.

wayne -

I'll just go along with yiou that I'm employed by the warehouse to come here and put a positive spin on everything. It sounds ridiculous, that an organization would call up a random person half a country away and pay them to write positive comments on a blog, but whatever. Going along with you on that will make things easier, I guess; at least we can stop arguing about one thing.

But anyway, I find it interesting that you comment that the spinners "can't back anything [they] say with real stats" when I haven't seen you post a single stat or fact supporting any of the arguments you're making.

You claim that the O's are in no better position than they were five years ago. Stats, please?

You claim that the Nationals, whose best starting pitcher (Strausburg) hasn't even tossed a pitch in the majors yet, will be better than the Orioles this coming season. Stats, please?

You claim that Garrett Atkins, who's coming off a career worst BABIP, which is almost a sure bet to improve, is no better than Mora, despite the fact that Atkins produced the exact same amount as Mora in 2009, in 100 fewer at bats. Where are your stats on that one?

You also keep saying that Mike Gonzalez isn't a proven closer, despite the fact that he's a pretty dominant lefty (career: 2.57 ERA, 10.6 K/9) with 54 career saves. That's much better than what we had with Sherrill going into 2008, and that worked out pretty well. Where are your stats on that one?

So before you tell me to back up my arguments with stats, why don't you do the same?

Brooksie

Never said you were a warehouse blogger. Defensive yes, paid blogger, i doubt it...

First stat.... 64 wins in 09' with yet another 2nd half collapse. 64 wins Brooksie!

Second stat.... Nats - just a hunch, not a terribly difficult prediction however. Sorry, no stat there.

Third stat... Another easy one. Mora and Sherill entering the 09' season (and listen please) had far more promise than we have with Atkins and Gonz going into 2010. You see that right?

You really do believe you're the Orioles version of Bill James. Instead of always trying to wow folks with your amazing stats and analysis though, maybe just look at the W - L columns for once.....

Wins and Losses baby.... that's all that matters and all real fans (and media) should ever care about. Everything else is bullshxt, filler and spin.

Five years ago the Orioles had a .457 winning percentage. Last year, .395.

Saying we are better than Toronto and Tampa Bay is pure conjecture. They are not just laying down. The Jays got pitching prospect Kyle Drabek, who by all accounts is as good as any Oriole prospect. They have cash after the Halladay trade. Their ptiching staff is young (Ricky Romero (age 25), Brett Cecil (23), Marc Rzepczynski (24) and Jesse Litsch (24)). Shawn Marcum, who is expected to rejoin the starting rotation next year after missing all of 2009 recovering from elbow surgery, is only 28.

Tampa's line-up is still better than the Orioles. They have some great prospects also, like Desmond Jennings and Jeremy Hellickson.

When the final standings are in-place, then get excited.

JoeFoss,

Awesome Post,

You see, baltimore fans and media act like the other teams (like those you mention) don't have significant prospects and youngsters as well. It's as if they think the Orioles are building in a way baseball has never seen.

It's beyond mind bending, especially knowing that the odds are GREAT that everyone is doing a better job......

Just seeing the 395 winning % is absolutely sickening..... especially when everyone knows we still won't get close (in 2010) to the 457% of five years ago.

Be prepared for the warehouse spin. Coming right up!

wayne -

Sure, we had more promise with Mora going into 2009 than we have with Atkins going into 2010. But it's not 2009 anymore. And I think Atkins has more promise than Mora heading into '10, mostly because of the expected gain in BABIP and that fact that he's eight years younger.

And I think we definitely have more promise with Gonzalez heading into 2010 than we had with Sherrill heading into 2009.

Here are the numbers:

Sherrill heading into '09: Almost 32 years old, 3.96 ERA and 35 saves, 9.7 K/9, 4.6 BB/9

Gonzalez heading into '10: Almost 32 years old, 2.57 career ERA and 54 saves, 10.6 K/9, 4.1 BB/9

Go ahead and call me Bill James again if you want, but the numbers are definitely working against you there.

You see, baltimore fans and media act like the other teams (like those you mention) don't have significant prospects and youngsters as well. It's as if they think the Orioles are building in a way baseball has never seen.

Wow. I must have skimmed over this gem.

Good Lord are you nearsighted...

Most, if not all, of the comments about the current rebuilding project are comments about how the new Orioles front office regime is much different from former administrations.

Wow... Just... Wow...

I've figured it all out. There is no Wayne. Wayne is Pete's alter ego that he uses to say the things he can't say officially and to defame anyone who disagrees with him. It really is a media conspiracy. How do you think Pete can afford all of these vacations now?

It's sad to see you're losing your edge though. Holding up St Louis as an example only serves to encourage their own mediocrity and waste of the best player of the generation. They're also in a nothing of a division where sub .500 has you in contention into September and the 2nd best player in the division was an Orioles cast off SS. Oh, and their manager is a convicted drunk driver. Yes, they do a great job of accountability out there too.

I suggest you don't post another rant until you propose how you would do in 3 months what others have failed at for 12 years. Specifically.

Apparently the warehouse employees are all over this blog, so they'll see your advice.

Address the major concerns as you see them. Include names of free agents, players to be traded for with realistic ideas of who to give up and the salaries you would offer. Because apparently there is a way to win the division in 2010 and you're the only one who knows how to do it. The rest of us live in a reality where the free agents of 2010 suck and the trade market is demanding a premium as a result of it that would cripple our farm system all over again.

James -

Bashing the Cardinals was a bad plan. Over the past ten years, they've won 90+ games six times while finishing under .500 just once and playing in two World Series, winning one. Doesn't seem like a waste of the best player in a generation to me. Especially considering the fact that only four teams have played in more than one World Series this decade.

Also, I'm damn sure I'd take Ryan Braun or Prince Fielder over Miguel Tejada. Heck, Tejada isn't even the best player on his team. Lance Berkman or Carlos Lee wins that honor. Oh I'd definitely take Chris Carpenter, Adam Wainwright, Derek Lee, Joey Votto and Yovani Gallardo over Miggy also.

I would like to see wayne's ideas about how to fix this team as well, but I think it was probably pretty stupid to ask him to do so in the same post that you bashed a pretty damn good organization that is light years ahead of our own.

not brooks,

Calm down. I was exaggerating obviously.

Although the crux of my argument is valid.

One. Their division is pathetic. Their 91 wins was worse than the wild card Rockies. Not to mention 2nd place Chicago is just 2 games over .500 and 3rd place Milwaukee is under .500.

Two. The Cards blew it in the NLDS in 2009 with the NL pitcher with the most wins (Wainwright), lowest ERA (Carpenter) and Pujols backing them up. It's all about wins and they didn't win when it mattered despite having the talent to do so. That makes them just like the Orioles at the very basic level of failing to meet expectations. When the Orioles fail to meet expectations there apparently is a conspiracy, paid off bloggers, liars, cheats, idiots and morons. Apparently when the Cards fail to meet expectations, they're a model franchise.

Using wayne's logic, they lost in 2009 and haven't done anything to improve in 2010 and fans should be revolting with pitchforks and torches there too.

PS I was being sarcastic with Tejada.

Matt Holliday in Baltimore? No way. The Orioles are once again being used by Scott Boros to up the ante so the Red Sox Or Yankees will raise their offer. Remember the Mark Texieria deal .last year. It happened the same way. You will never see a big name free agent sign with the Orioles until Angelos either comes to his senses and opens the vault or sells the team. He is always holding the fans and this once proud and respected franchise hostage. The only free agents that will ever be signed will be all these mediocre players.

James C,

I've never come close to asking for a contender in 2010. All I've asked for is marked improvement. How about 75 wins?

Millwood is only an improvement because of the pathetic rotation AM put on the field at the beginning of 09'.

Atkins is a poor to average player at best. That's not an opinion. Read the articles coming out of Colorado.

They have no one at first, unless you count players they have on the roster who can fill in.

We have no idea if Gonz can be a full time closer, Bergesen may still be having issues with his injury, Jones hasn't been able to stay on the field 2 years running, we have a decent fielding ss who can't hit, there's no true 4 or 5 hitter...... and we're banking on other young starters who have proven nothing in the major league so far........ I could go on and on.

And you think they'll improve? You have absolutely nothing to back that up.

You want a plan? Listen, I don't pretend to be a GM. All I know is that what I've described above hardly constitutes a 'team'. Suggesting otherwise is pure unfounded 'spin'

And by the way... Brooksie caught your ignorance concerning the Cards, and all you did was back peddle. That you don't see how that organization is run helps you to lose any cred you may have had.

Wayne (and Not Brooks),

You both missed my whole point, although wayne did help me make it anyway after you butted in nb. My rant was intentionally absurd. I was making light of "holding them accountable." Since wayne can never see when someone makes a point contrary to his, I thought he could stand to see what he sounds like to people like me when he spouts off about the Orioles. Sure enough, he thought of me what most of us think of him.

Though it is absurd to compare the Orioles to a team in a division that is pretty weak. I also think it's absurd to say a rebuilding effort is flawed because it doesn't compare to a team that rebuilt itself almost a decade ago. Adam Wainwright is a great example. He was ok as a reliever coming up in 2006 and no different than any rookie pitcher the Orioles brought up in 2009. Maybe I missed the Wainwright talk in 2006, but I don't remember anyone saying he'd definitely be a 19 game winner and going 233 innings as a starter anytime soon.

No one had anything to prove that Tampa Bay would improve like they did. Same for Colorado and Florida. I don't think anyone had facts to say some of those teams were poised to break through. I don't think it was media spin that made them win either.

No one knows, not even you. I just get tired of "you have no facts" when you don't either. So then we agree that none of us have anything other than speculation. I just think there needs to be some kind of truce on this ridicule just because people disagree.

Mike Gonzalez could be the next Jamie Walker or he could be Sherrill or better? Who knows? Atkins could be anything at all. Personally, Mora was addition by subtraction in itself to me. His play is declining and he was the only negative voice in the locker room. Maybe Jones never gets it together for 162, but OF is a deep FA pool every year. Bergesen seems to be fine. Reports from the Shriver tennis tournament said he was running all over the place in his charity match. I doubt he even flies out from CA if there was lingering injury concerns.

I sometimes wonder why we even argue so much when we want the same thing at the end of the day.