Playing baseball while a 50 year dictatorship jails and beats up any dissenter sounds like something only Schmucks could enjoy!

Any chance this is also a Chapman play?

I think the trip is great idea if Angelos and his whole family goes. Maybe Castro won't let them leave! That would be the best thing that could happen to the Orioles.

I attended the Cuba/Orioles at Camden Yards in '99. In fact, I still have the Program and tickets (which I had both autographed by Elrod Hendricks :). I was a bit embarrassed at the lack of enthusiasm displayed by the '99 team playing that game. And with Scott Kaminiecki assigned to pitch that game, the writing was on the wall.

Here are two questions, who pays for this exchange and how much will it ultimately cost? I would think that an organization which has bitterly complained about being unable to match the spending of rival clubs within its division while trying to rebuild and make substantial overtures to available free agents would be thinking about ways to CONSERVE funds, not ways to spend money on a pair of baseball games that will merit, at best, a footnote in a history textbook. This organization really has no idea about priorities, does it? The last pair of Cuban games led to ZERO free agents from Cuba signing with the organization and yielded no diplomatic breakthroughs so if those are the arguments for another round then they have to try a little harder to convince someone this is a good idea. "P" is for PUH-LEASE.

wtf? what the f'n f?

Yeah 11 straight losing seasons after those games, maybe it was a curse?

On a side note we have a problem with Cubas 50+ years of brutal dictorship, but no problems with China's brutal dictatorship. Maybe if we can get Castro to be willing to enslave his peasents to make cheap crap for Wal-Mart things will be different?

What impact, exactly, is this game expected to have that other international competitions with Cuba haven't had?

As for the hypocritical US policy toward Cuba, I really don't think that comes into play here. The hypocrisy with China doesn't change the fact that Castro is still a brutal dictator, and Angelos should be embarrassed to be photographed buddying around with him.

Furthermore, it probably hurts our chances at signing Chapman, as Angelos' friendship with Castro would probably make him disinclined to sign a freshly defected Cuban player.

Why are people so against this, it is a good thing. What is the fuss about?

Peter: You should have left the flowered shirts at home. They would have never known if you dressed different.

Great picture for the article. Three dictators.

Trade Angelos for Elián González.

Baseball is loved by the people of the United States and Cuba. Getting together again to play ball is a good thing.

I've had Tony Oliva on my mind a lot today. What a ballplayer. It is a shame that bad knees cut short his career. In the mid 60s, Oliva was one of the top players I had the pleasure of watching. He was a Rod Carew with power.

Do they have any pitchers who can throw strikes? We really need pitching so maybe we can smuggle a pitcher or two back in El Schmuck-o's luggage.

Hello Pete

Long time no post . I dont mean to get off topic here . But I had this Baseball question to ask you . Here goes:
Do you forsee a time in near future , with the disparity , apathy , ecomonic , and attendance issues , some Owners might decide to file for bankruptcy and let Seling 'contract' that team(s)?
In other words , make all those players subject either free agents or put in sort dispersal draft ? But the desired result is to abolish those 25 Major League positions . So Owners can use this as an bargaining chip against the Players' Union/Agents ?
Do you see such a scenario on the horizon? Thanks for your time .

EC, best line in a long time ... very funny.

Anyway, I didn't get it then. I don't get it now.

Ping Pong diplomacy made sense in that it involved a way for two super powers to get together while publicly rattling swords. The fact there was a third super power on the sideline being equally affected made it either worthwhile or a worthwhile effort (depending on viewpoint).

Cuba is a nosebleed little country of little relevance except they happen to be near our border (Jeb Bush can see them from his house), and they have a wonderful, state-of-the-art health care system we need to emulate as soon as stinking possible no matter what the cost.

Baseball-wise, I was at the debacle played at the Greek Ruins at Camden Yards. The Orioles had a cute contest to see who could care the least. It was a 15-way tie as I remember it.

I wonder if the Soviet missiles had asbestos.

Unbelievable. I have been to Havana, and I can never get over the protestations of the ignorant who know next to nothing about Cuba except what they have been spoon-fed by the Miami Spin Machine. They know nothing about Fulgencia Batista, who was the brutal USA puppet dictator . I suggest if you want to swing your no-nothing politics around, people, you air those opinions in the backyard. Baseball, like the Olympics, can transcend these barriers of mistrust and ill conceived conceptions on both sides. Try to understand that America should spread Democracy through example and not through draconic 50 year old embargoes. Fidel is infirm and most likely dying if you ever bothered to actually read the paper other than the sports page. Reform has already begun under Raul Castro. Until you know what Hershey, the United Fruit Company, Bacardi and others did to exploit the Cuban people and until you know about Batista's goons whose brutality sparked the revolution, stick to reading the sports page instead of pontificating about what you do not know.

Distinctive website devoted to Cuba, its covers all Cuban popular destinations and attractions, as well culture information and events. www.Netssa.com

Netssa.com offer plenty of historic info about Havana, also all the Varadero attractions. The website future extensive travel to Cuba info, also all about scuba diving and snorkeling centers, all over island of Cuba.

The website presents plenty of striking photos from all over the Cuba island.

So if you are planning to visit Cuba, or are just looking for information about Cuba you should check site http://www.netssa.com/cuba.html

I don't usually partake in the Angelos bashing, but maybe before Mr. Angelos saves the world he should wait until the Orioles are saved. I wonder what will come first--a more competitive Orioles franchise or improved Cuban-American relations?

Jose A: Do you really believe the US government has been jailing and beating dissidents for 50 years? I would have said more like 40-plus, dating to the 1968 Republican convention, but maybe I'm just being nostalgic about the good old days. But one thing true about those days, all us boys carried our gloves with us everywhere, and went in and out of multiple baseball scenes every day. Who wouldn't want t6o go play a few games in a country where that's still happening?

it's a lose lose!

Pete -- I hope you don't get involved with this again. Cuba is takes advantage of any such overtures as an opportunity to legitimize its brutal rule.

"In terms of human rights violations in Latin America, Cuba is in a league by itself," says Peter DeShazo of the Center for Strategic and International Studies. Of course, the change from Fidel Castro to his brother Raul is being touted by some as a mandate for change, but Raul was part of the brutal Soviet-backed 1959 revolution and today oversees a system of political oppression that includes 230 political prisoners held in the most inhumane conditions. It's replacing one murderer with another.

Raul Castro one of the most dangerous leaders
http://www.rd.com/your-america-inspiring-people-and-stories/quick-study-worlds-most-dangerous-leaders/article107242.html

The myth of Raul bringing real reform to the island is belied by his purge of young reform-minded officials earlier this year.

"Heads roll in Havana
http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/03/heads_roll_in_havana_baffling.html

As long as Communism controls Cuba great human suffering is a given. Estimates of the deaths attributable to the Castro regime range from 35,000 to 141,000. Thousands upon thousands of Cuban "boat people" have left everything and fled to the United States in unseaworthy vessels to escape the persecution and poverty that are part and parcel with that regime.

Genocide under Castro
http://www.cubaverdad.net/genocide.htm

What about that wondeful Cuban health care Michael Moore was touting in his grossly misleading film Sicko. Well, there's a fine facility for foreigners and party officials and for the rest of Cubans there are facilities that would be shut down in a heartbeat if they were in America.

Cuba's horrendous heathcare
http://www.therealcuba.com/Page10.htm

Many of the celebrities (like Michael Moore) who support opening trade with Cuba are the ones who clamored the most for an embargo against South Africa (talk about double standards!). I believe Peter Angelos will put himself into this same category of "useful idiots" (a term coined in Soviet Russia signifying Westerners who unwittingly promoted Communist aims by urging cooperation as a key to peace and progress).

Castro's useful idiots
http://www.therealcuba.com/The%20Useful%20Idiots.htm

mojito -- I am confident that most of the readers of this blog will note that your rhetoric about Batista being a "USA puppet dictator " is precisely what is found in Granma and other Castroite propaganda rags. Shame on you for trying to peddle that rubbish here. Why do you defend a murderous tyrant like Fidel Castro (brother Raul also has blood on his hands--we know his "reform" is just window dressing to get a handout for his criminal regime).
Hypocrites like the filthy rich Fidel, Raul and their Communist henchman pretend to care about the poor, but live in luxury while the poor get poorer in Cuba.

Castro the multimillionaire
http://www.therealcuba.com/Castro%20the%20multimillionaire.htm

Netssa -- That website is sooo deceptive. Most of Havana is urban blight that would be razed if it was in any U.S. city. That economic basket case of a country goes out of it's way to segregate tourists in comfortable quarters, it's citizens live in squalor.

The two Cubas
http://www.therealcuba.com/two_cubas.htm

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Pete's reply: I doubt I would be involved this time. I can tell you that I was never naive enough to think Raul Castro represented real change over there.

Fire Snyder

I have lived under a communist government and have no fondness for communism. That said, I think that while the benefits of an economic boycott are debatable (ie, strengths and weaknesses on both sides of the argument), there is no debate as to the benefit of cultural exchanges.

Isolation strengthens the hands of dictators; the more Cubans see and experience normalcy (no jokes about how normal the Orioles are), the less tolerant they will be for the regime. And even a dictatorship needs some level of support from the people. Here is a link to a radio program the BBC did about the effect of the Beatles on the USSR (not equating the Orioles level of performance with the Beatles). http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/documentaries/2009/02/090204_beatles_ussr.shtml

Some will argue that this gives legitimacy to a dictator. After 50 years, how much more legitimacy do the Castros need? On the worldwide stage they are far better known than either Angelos or Selig.

So go to Cuba. Be good ambassadors. And tear down more walls.

Unless the idea is to smuggle Gourriel and Cepeda back to the US and make them part of the O's organization, those exhibition games are pointless.

Pete, Refreshing to hear that from you.

I'm not sure what's so difficult in demanding as preconditions to any improvement in U.S.-Cuban relations such simple things as the release of political prisoners, freedom of speech and the press, opposition parties and democratic elections.

What I see coming is an opportunity for multinational corporations to "partner" with Castro just as they do in Communist China, which is to take advantage of plentiful slave labor in an effort to boost their profit margin. The conditions have never improved in China (we could not be having open discussions like this on the internet) and American workers are cheated out of jobs (I think the playing field needs to be leveled to where U.S. companies using overseas labor should be forced to pay tariffs).

It would be hoped that the government would learn from China and not allow this to be repeated in Cuba. Unless real, substantive change takes place there should be no change of that nation's status vis-a-vis.

Human lives should be held above corporate profits.

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Pete's reply: Well, you know you're not going to get much pro-communist propaganda from me, but I don't know that you can say engagement with China has not raised the standard of living in China. Clearly it has. I agree, however, that the regime there remains very repressive, as in Cuba. I don't see anything happening in Havana to change that any time soon, but -- and I'm trying to be objective here -- I can't see how the half-century embargo has furthered US interests or helped improve human rights in Cuba. If anything, it probably strengthened Castro's hand, judging by the fact that all the other North American dictators of the past are long gone and he's still standing.

Pete, Well, I hope I don't get any
pro-communist propaganda from you (LOL).

The thaw with China began 40 years ago when Nixon and Kissinger brought "ping pong diplomacy" to the land of Mao, but since then little has changed for the Chinese people. You say "the standard of living" has been raised since then, but what do you mean by that...how much money someone is making?

If so, maybe yes, but still we're talking about what? An extra bowl of rice a day? A dozen people crammed into a one bedroom apartment as opposed to 15 or 16 people? Some amenities brought over by Western coroporations?

It's when we look at the quality of life in China that we see nothing has really changed; in some aspects, it's arguably worse. There we see (to cite a few examples):

* the government-sanctioned murder of political prisoners for organ transplants

* government control of reproductive rights, including the criminalization of pregnancy (one-child policy)

* the continuing oppression and genocide (both cultural and actual) of Tibetans

* the ongoing repression of any religious group perceived to be a threat to the atheisitic ruling body, including the Falun Gong, Tibetan Buddhists, Muslim Uighurs, and underground Protestants and Catholics.

* total supression of freedoms we take for granted in America, such as religion, speech, the press, assembly, private ownership of firearms, privacy, the forming of opposition politcal parties, etc.

* total government control over what people know (for the latest, see the censorship of President Obama's remarks urging the Communists to end censoring the internet)

The regime there has little regard for human life. The organist at the church I attend visited China in the 1990s as a student studying the Chinese language. One think that stuck him almost immediately when he arrived in Beijing was the sight of a man doing welding at a construction site...without a welder's mask!

Here are photos from various websites that confirm what my friend saw: welders in China wearing a worthless do-it-yourself masks.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/money/galleries/2009/fortune/0908/gallery.china_high_speed_train.fortune/images/blowy_070109_cb_0161.jpg

http://images.travelpod.com/users/markwilliams84/3.1212059520.img_6626.jpg

http://www.draftsperson.net/index.php?title=Chinese_paper_welding_mask

Not surprisingly, those in other industries suffer similarly from shoddy (or no) safety devices. Here's a worker in a makeshift breathing apparatus "designed" to prevent him from breathing dust particles.

http://www.boycottcommunism.com/contruction/mask.jpg

And finally here's a photo of a "scaffold" in use (note that the worker stands on a board over a drop-off of undetermined height, while being supported by three workers standing on the other end--as a writer for that website notes, here's part of the reason why "Made in China" products come so cheap, not to mention why they're so prone to recalls)

http://www.boycottcommunism.com/contruction/scaffold.jpg

What's the quality of life for these people, Pete; not so good, I think you'll agree.

So in China there's been the opposite of an embargo in place for decades and conditions there are still horrible.

As for the 50-year embargo of Cuba, which you argue may have strengthened Castro's hand, I think there are some other factors that need to be kept in mind here. First, for most of those 50 years, Cuba was the Soviet Union's direct surrogate in the Western Hemisphere and was thus considered the Kremlin's bastion. Communism has never worked economically, but Cuba under Castro was such a basket case that for 30 years Moscow subsidized it, pouring millions of rubles down that Caribbean rathole. For those years certainly, the effect of the propping up mitigated for Castro any effect an American embargo would have.

Since the reorganizing of Russia into a federation, Cuba has been propped up by other relations with other nations such as Canada, which has always seemed soft that way, China and, most recently, Venuzuela with it's Castro clone, Hugo Chavez.

In other words, there's no way we can say that Castro was strengthened by the embargo; rather, due to financial assistance he consistently has received from other countries, the effect of the embargo never had a chance to work. And what anyone else does should never deter us from doing what is right.

I find that there are some good reasons advanced for embargos and the like at the blog below:

http://tim.2wgroup.com/blog/archives/000318.html

I think MLB is interested in opening up Cuba as a market. Ditto with China.The plight of these captive people doesn't seem to register very much on Selig, Angelos and associates. Perhaps they haven't thought it through the way they should. (I believe Cal got suckered into advancing the China market by being given the "goodwill ambassdor" title.)

This idea that sports (or music or the arts or what have you) is going to make a totalitarian regime suddenly become all warm and cuddly is nonsense squared and has been proven so time and again through history. (Did, say,staging the 1936 Olympics in Germany change Hitler for the better?)

All one has to look at is China since Yao Ming was drafted by the Houston Rockets in 2002. What's changed? Well, they've got someone over in the States who distracts from their brutalities by playing hoops, putting a happy face on doings of a thoroughly contemptible government.

I really hope the plan to revisit Havana is reconsidered, because no good can come of it.

"In a time of universal deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act." -- George Orwell

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Pete's reply: I think this is a discussion for another time and place. If you listen to my radio show, you know I'm virulently anti-communist, so we're not arguing philosophy here, but I think you're arguing apples and oranges. I'm talking about standard of living and you're talking about human rights. They may be intertwined, but I doubt you can make a real case that the average Chinese citizen hasn't seen a significant improvement in his or her material standard of living, unless you're setting up your own perameters and putting your own values on each one. I agree with your criticisms of the Chinese and Cuban systems, but I can't see how trying to starve the Cuban people was ever going to make them embrace American democratic ideals. If you want to continue this conversation, I suggest you email me at peter.schmuck@baltsun.com so that we don't have to subject all the sports fans to our personal discussion.

Might wanna tighten up on security. Good chance some of the O's may want to defect.