fire trembley

This manager does not know how to win. And the coaching staff does not know how to coach winning baseball.

oh man the orioles debut of Sean Penn!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We're up to seven pitchers....and counting.

I guess this is a great way to assess talent????

Spring traing at Fenway

Dave Trembley should be fired and very quickly. We've had enough of his lack of fundamental baseball.

JD Drew will never live down striking out to Sean Henn

Pete, you finally are saying what I and many other fans have been saying about Dave Trembley. He takes out relievers who are getting the job done and sooner or later someone will have a bad night. And Henderickson was very successful against the next batter after Ortiz but DT yanks him. DT does not have a lot to work with but he over-manages and has lost the team a few games. Lets hire a guy with a clue to lead the youngsters next year.

Pete -

I just read your article on the Ravens. I was hoping that you would stick more with the theme of O's - Ravens. Owners, GM's, managers, coaches....

The Colts' departure brought us the Ravens. I don't believe Angelos will move the team, but then that means another X number of losing years. Either way, it's not good for us.

It almost seems like we can't handle 2 big league teams. Or maybe the Balt-DC can't handle 2 MLB teams.

Anyway, good article. Boy, we better win Sunday!

GO RAVENS!!!

Actually all we needed to know is: 1) Boston loaded the bases w/2 out in the 1st and scored two runs and 2) Baltimore loaded the bases with none out in the 2nd and scored 1 run [maybe the Boston DP was a great play that robbed the O's of a 2nd run -- can't tell as I can only follow the games online]. Some days following this team feel like the the descent to the 7th level in Dante's Inferno...and since Dante's Paradiso eventually follows, I'll cling to the "hope springs eternal" mantra for as long as it takes.

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Pete's reply: Sorry to disappoint you, but it was a room service double play.

Didnt DT used to be a bullpen coach?!?

As soon as Trembly took Berken out, I knew we were in for trouble. You simply can't play "matchups" with good offensive teams like this, especially when most of the bullpen has been less than spectacular, to put it mildly. Whatever happened to leaving a reliever in until he just becomes ineffective ?? Or for that matter, leaving the starter in ( oh yeah, the all-important pitch count fallacy). Albers tends to blow up at the most inopportune times, and Baez, as much as I was rooting for him at the beginning of the season, will never be a top of the line reliever. This team has got to be a LOT better next year, and I am sure this is the absolute last season that the fans will fall for the "have patience" line.

I don't understand why Trembley will over use the bullpen, but no pinch hitters or runners? Pinch running for Wiggington and pinch hitting for Izturis in the 8th. Or even pinch hitting for Mora in the 9th?.

I would have like him to leave Berken to finish the 6th, just to see if he's head strong enough to get out of trouble. It appears Berkin has figured some things out, Trembley gave up on him to early.

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Pete's reply: I don't know about hitting for Mora. He's finally swinging the bat well.

"Maybe he doesn't have any other choice"

I'm not sure how Trembley is forced to use a boatload of proven unreliable relievers. Especially in a winnable game. We've witnessed this "reliever roulette" for far too long. Are you insinuating that Trembley is being told from higher up the management chain that he must run all these guys out there, possibly for evaluation? Otherwise, well, it just doesn't bode well for the manager. MacPhail can see much more then we do.

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Pete's reply: I don't know the answer, but it is possible that this is a mass bullpen audition.

It is audition time, that also takes in a lot of these moves, to see if the lefties can handle the job. Really if Baez does not throw the ball down the middle and belt buckle high to Martinez, there is nothing to talk about.

Pete, If it was about winning, I do not believe these guys out of the pen would not be here.

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Pete's reply: Maybe, but I don't know who would be here instead. I'm disappointed in Baez. It seems when he's in a low-pressure middle situation, his ball moves really well. When it's a one-run situation, everything is up and straight. Maybe he was right in the spring. Maybe he should find somebody this winter who will let him be a fifth starter.

When will the Zeros fing a few hitters who don't strike out with the bases loaded?? How many times has that happened this year!! A couple of pitchers who can at least go seven or eight innings would be nice too!! All the "young talant" in the world will do no good if they can't deliver in the clutch!

Where is Daniel Cabrera? At least he put up a fight 18 runs 26 hits. Not one hit batter after giving up 6 hr they need someone with a backbone

Pete, you're not posting replies and taking the quote light work unquote under the name Lucky, and then thanking yourself for the unnecessary help and mildly scolding yourself for name calling, are you? Now this isn't just a way to get around talking about yourself in the third person, is it?
Just checking.

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Pete's reply: I'm surprised it took somebody this long to figure that out.

I'm not sure why the O's like Mr. Opportunity so much, but the 2nd inning sure was another blown opportunity.

overmanaging
the matching up is highly overated
I wish people would stop saying thatthose of us who have problems with Trembley are delusional and think we would have been in the playoffs. I criticize him for the following repeated mistakes which have cost us his "5-10" games that a manger can lose you..
lineups that are out of wack
constant matchups like tonight for no reason other than this "righty verse righty" overhyped nonsense
burying Pie early on
giving Mora way too many at bats and now wiggington
we know them enough
the main thing is his lack of in game management which is primarily hit and run stuff and relief pitchers.
He has not shown the skills even taking into account the lack of talent.
This post by Pete is excellent.
There is no reason Castillo couldn't have pitched a couple innings.
OVERMANAGING AGAIN

Two things...1st. I have to give it to Berken, the kid has hung tough all year, has certainly gotten much better & he's never dodged a start. If he pitched for the Sox or Yankees they'd be singing his praises.
Two...Dave seems really clueless when it comes to having a feel for where the game is going & who to leave in or take out. I fully realize it's far easier sitting here right now second guessing his moves but, most of us are screaming at the tv when he's making these moves in real time. I feel bad for him that this is the mess he's been dealt but he's got to improve in his understanding of what some of these misfits bring to the table & quite honestly...many should not be invited to sit at this table ever again.
Andy...these Orioles stink up the place more now than ever before...thanks. Rebuilding Plan # 74 is quite the success!

"Fire Trembley?"

Let's not until we have someone to replace him. And by someone I mean, a guy who has proven he can turn a club around, someone who has a track record and some clout. Don't just fire him to fire him.

"...reliever roulette..."

"...Riverdance in a minefield..."

Solid gold, Pete! How do you come up with this stuff?!?!

"It wasn't hard to see where this game was headed" pretty much sums it up. I had a feeling the game was over once I saw DT mouth the word "Baez" to the umpire.

I've really enjoyed following your blog this year, Pete, all the way from the first day of spring training (wow that seems like a long time ago). Look forward to it again next year.

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Pete's reply: Thanks, but we're not done yet. And the offseason is really a more fertile blog period than the season, so stay tuned.

okay... so this is how it has gone all season for the relievers...

if you come in and get an out (Castillo, Hendrickson), you are out of the game....

If you allow a hit or a walk, you stay in the game.... if you allow another hit or a walk, you stay in the game... if you allow another hit or a walk you stay in the game....

So the moral of the story is.... if you want to stay in the game, don't get the batter out!

DT has no clue on how to mange a bullpen....

Really would rather see them win games like this, but face it this is like exhibition season for the Orioles at this point. Remember after this weekend, they shut down are top two pitching prospects. A lot of people give Trembley a hard time for playing Mora, but I like the fact he is sticking by him and let him finish the season playing and giving him a chance to have a little success on what has been a dismal year.

You have to have hope that MacPhail will be more aggressive on finding better experienced talent to help this team out of this hole.

Melvin Mora made the last out in several innings and has consistently failed to get clutch hits. Put him in the bullpen, hand him a catcher's mitt and let him warm up relievers. Watching him play baseball is excruciating.

Bill Frederick;

Do not take me the wrong way. I am not a defender of DT. I do think you go a little over the top though when you say that he has cost the Os 10 wins. If that were true, they would have a 475 winning percentage at this point and would be headed for a 75 win season. Do you honestly believe that the Os would be close to being a 500 team with just a managerial change. Not a chance in my opinion. Casey Stengal reincarnated would not lead this team to the break even mark.

100 losses without a doubt and worst team in the AL. You start a season with Adam Eaton on your team and you ask for this.

I have no idea what the manager is trying to do or prove out there. Let the kids play, Dave, stop trying act as if you are Joe McCarthy(someone known as a push-button manager).
I must say I've given up trying to defend him or the team. I do still believe in "The Plan", and I do believe it will yield great results in time. But not with this manager.
I know he knows more about baseball than you or I will ever know, but why does it seem like his every decision blows up in his and the team's face?
No one could have luck that bad.

Just curious bill:

- How many pitchers did the Red Sox use?
- Have you ever seen a playoff game?

No reason I ask those questions. Don't read too much into it. Has nothing to do with how relievers are used by managers that win. Nope, just me being curious, trying to find out more about a fellow commentor.

TerryP, You asked me how, if (as I contend) a rebuilding team shouldn't trade key players, the Orioles could trade Sherrill.

My answer is that Sherrill represented an area of relative strength for the team, as Johnson could easily be plugged into the closer role and excel. And were he to fail, there would be several other reasonable options including former closer Ray, though he's still not all the way back yet; Mickolio, though he needs a bit more polish; and even Uehara, who was successful in that role in Japan. I believe all of these hurlers could step into that role and be quite good.

(My personal favorite and the one I think could be absolutely dominant if he ever harnesses his ability is Mickolio. Here's a guy who's 6'9" and throws a 97 mph heater from a three-quarters arm slot across the body, a pitch that must look like it's 100 mph to opposing hitters. Electric!)

The O's have between now and Opening Day 2010 to determine the closer; while Johnson is the clear frontrunner and has the job right now, any of the others mentioned could conceivably assume the role if he falters, though probably only Ray is being seriously considered at this time.

This situation is different than at many other positions, where the team's lack of depth simply doesn't give them the luxury of trading away key parts of the puzzle.

Bill.,

I also believe you are a little over the top and that is not necessarily a bad thing. You are emotional about your team, and that is good. Bob is right, Stengel would have had about 100 comments weekly about how how bad this club is. Still my favorite on one liners and the best was comparing the two 20 year old players he had, saying in ten years one could be a star, the other in ten years has a chance to be 30. Thanks Bob for bringing his name up. But really we are much better than the Mets team that Casey had.It is tough to say Trembley and Stengel in the same sentence.

Really Bill this team was picked for last and did not surprise anyone. How could you expect anything more than what they have done. The good thing is the Orioles found out a lot this year, and the learning process does not mean anything unless you fix what you have learned. It is a very interesting job that MacPhail has, no one in baseball but him would be given this kind of leash in Baltimore under Angelos. Heck the old GM's did a pretty good job, look at the core of pitchers that were brought up this year, yes MacPhail was completely responsible for Tillman but Matusz was really a no brainer. but the rest of them were from the old regime. Same with Reimold and Weiters (even though MacPhail did the final ink). The Beddard trade is one of the few steals we have had in a long time, probably back to the seventies when they robbed the Yankees blind. Look how good Sherrill is doing for the Dodgers, just hope somehow Bell works out for the Orioles.

I think that everyone sees the same thing, but Trembley does not pitch, Samuel and Shelby do not hit and Rick Kranitz does not pitch. But if you guys want to see them all fired, that is fine, you will find a different four next year that you can beat up on.

TerryP, You asked me how, if (as I contend) a rebuilding team shouldn't trade key players, the Orioles could trade Sherrill.

My answer is that Sherrill represented an area of relative strength for the team, as it knew Johnson could easily be plugged into the closer role and excel. And there were a number of reasonable backup options as well, including former closer Ray, though he's still not all the way back yet; Mickolio, though he needs a bit more polish; and even Uehara, who was successful in that role in Japan. I believe all of these hurlers could step into that role and be quite good.

(My personal favorite and the one I think could be absolutely dominant if he ever harnesses his ability is Mickolio. Here's a guy who's 6'9" and throws a 97 mph heater from a three-quarters arm slot across the body, a pitch that must look like it's 100 mph to opposing hitters. Electric!)

The O's have between now and Opening Day 2010 to determine the closer; while Johnson is the clear frontrunner and has the job right now, any of the others mentioned could conceivably assume the role if he falters, though probably only Ray is being seriously considered at this time.

This situation is different than at many other positions, where the team's lack of depth simply doesn't give them the luxury of trading away key parts of the puzzle.

DT, doesn't have anyone to blame but himself. I know this isn't a great team, but it's not like AM, said to play .500 in the 2nd half or else. Dave, could've said to hell with the guys not producing like Wiggy, Scott, etc., and shake things up, but didn't and he still wont play guys like Aubrey with any consistency to see what would happen. Pie is only playing because of the injury to Adam. The Captain, chose to not rock the boat and he will go down with the ship, and if he is counting on 1st mate Juan, to tell him when to jump, he is REALLY out of luck!

I was upset that when Henn came into the game, he wasn't called by his nickname, Milk.

Pete, every time you bring up the Rays as an example of a team that was built through the draft, people say one hit wonder, but the O's aren't in the same boat as the Rays. The O's have way more money than the Rays. Pete, don't you think if the O's had the players that the Rays have, they would be spending the money to bolster the team? I certainly do. People can trash P.A. for as long as it took Wiggy's Dad to get off the phone during rounding the bases, but the fact is, he spends money on the wrong guys. Baez, Walker, Bradford, Huff, Miggy, Raffy, Lopez, Segui, Cordova and Ponson, were all paid very handsomely. People think after Albert, no money was being spent, it was, but on the wrong guys.

l have a strong feeling that D.T. will be gone after this season. But if he has to go, should the entire coaching staff! lncluding the great Terry Crowley, who's hitters choke in the clutch time after time! l see no future in Mora, Scott, or Wigginton on this team either. As for the bullpen....#$@!!*. Let some of those "great young arms" get started in middle relief?

Michael, I agree with you that the BP should be filled with guys like Berken and Hernandez, as it doesn't make sense for guys to go to AAA and dominate when they could be facing big league hitters in middle relief which is a crucial part of the game. Palmer, talks about how pitchers would come up and earn their stripes in the pen and while I know times have changed, I think guys that are ticketed to carry the team like Tillman, should be given every opportunity to start in the majors or minors, but guys in the next tier like Jason and David, could not only benefit from working out of the pen, but gain experience that might lead to success as starters down the road.

I think one of the biggest problems for the O's managers is they aren't allowed to have their own guys. Kranny in my book, is the one guy that should stay. He's worked with over 50 pitchers this year which is a joke, but he's gotten a lot of the young kids and as we've seen in the past, switching pitching coaches, sometimes can have a negative impact, but like in football, coaches need to surround themselves with their guys that they know will do the job the way they want.

I am too lazy to look it up, but I think Wiggy has 34 RBIs which is a joke for a power hitter. I'm actually ashamed of myself for thinking Luke should've been in the All Star game. He doesn't even deserve to start for the O's. This guy can't be counted on to produce and shame on the O's if they give Luke, a starting job at 1B or DH in 2010. I don't know if anyone else notices, but Luke is always smiling and laughing, and I always wonder what the hell are these guys so happy about? The money is obvious, but where is the pride? This is one of the worst seasons in the history of this great franchise so nobody should be patting themselves on the back. I hate to keep pointing fingers at DT, but once I would like to hear him say, the way we play isn't acceptable and every man on that field needs to bring it every night, but instead it's we gave it our best or if we just would've gotten one more hit. Please!

Ken Francis. I think Sherill was a key part of our 'pen and not sure if Johnson can close, Ray looks lost and now Mickilio has a sore arm. Anyway, our 'pen is in shambles and we need more than Sherill to fix it. Looks like open tryouts in the spring.
Birdland Todd-I agree with your assessment of Scott/Wiggy. They should both be gone by next year but Wiggy has a 3 Mill contract so I doubt that they'll eat that. The only team he'd ever get so much playing time is the O's but I'd like to see him get 150 AB if he does come back.
Mora???time to hang it up and if they even consider him for next year, then the O's really don't have a clue. It shouldn't be too hard to find a 3B to slug .350 and knock in 40 runs!
I'm not sure we are in much better shape than the Royals or Pirates so hopefully, MacPhail has some magic up his sleeve.

Dear Andy MacPhail,

One definition of insanity is to keep doing the same thing over and over again, but somehow expecting a "different result."

No, I don't mean Trembley with his game after game tendency to pull relievers out when they do their job, only to stick with a reliever when he doesn't do his job.

I mean YOU! Why would you expect to keep bringing Trembley back to manage, but somehow "expecting a different result?"

Great comments last nite and this AM. It is absolutely true that Trembley yanks relievers who get outs and sticks with those throwing batting practice - interpersed with senseless walks. Where does this come from? As for Luke Scott...the guy was on fire, found his stroke before the All-Star game, but has been completely dissed and more importantly, marginalized by DT. Who else would put the player on the team with the most homers and RBI per bat in the 7th slot?! Scott sees nothing but junk since the 8th and 9th batters follow. His promised practice time at 1st base? - 3 games. Scott is a second thought to DT behind Pie, Wigginton, and anybody else who shows up. A Durocher or a Pinella would have nurtured Scott, but instead he is shunned like a leper in the dugout. Maybe he should have cried "foul" like Mora; it worked for him. He's played almost every innning since he trashed the manager. I hope they trade Scott to someone who knows how to use him. I've followed the Orioles since I saw Countrney hot the first HR back in 1954; this is the lowest. Re-building should not include humiliation. The only thing worse than the management of this team is cheesy and embarassing ads on MASN. Geez guys - get a life! Watching nerdy actors act pumped about nearly fictionalized anecdotes is as condescending as it is foolish.

I knew when DT said "Baez" that this was a lost cause and it was a certainty when Martinez faced him. I could just see that long hit. Its too bad but DT just sees himself a a major league manager and he just isn't. Please no more Moapy (don't hurt my feelings) (Mora), Scott, Wigginton. By the way how did Mora not get that error? We know what these bums can do and it isn't much

The man is the anti-Weaver as to his bullpen usage. This, as much as anything, is why he is not suited to manage the Orioles to contention. Quite simply, his bullpen philosophy is terrible.

OK Bum,

Who would you have picked to pitch against probably the hottest hitter on the Redsox right now, that happens to be a switch hitter?

It is what it is, a throw away year..

Also DT is a major league manager, he actually gets a pay check from a major league club to manage. Who would you have manage this club? The fact is he is a puppet to MacPhail, good or bad, thick or thin. That is the way it goes. Not to many great managers would take the job. Unless they became unemployed. The Orioles upper level management do not help the manager here. The deals they make are really about rebuilding and tearing down at this point. Do you think that guys like Torre or LaRussa want to come to this mess at this point of their careers, these guys demand winners on the field, right now, not in three years are so.

Weaver had it a little different, he had a better starting rotation every year he coached and also a better bullpen. Earl would have his starters complete 40-70 games, but those days are long over, it is not the 1970's any longer, this is 2009 and like it or not this is the way it is.

Pete in all honesty do you feel this plan is working. And next year when we see the same or similiar results will you be man enough to start questioning the direction of this team.

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Pete's reply: I don't know what my manhood has to do with anything, but yes, I believe The Plan is the only way out of the mess the Orioles made over the decade before MacPhail. If they lose 100 games next year, I'll be happy to admit it that Andy failed to turn an expansion-quality team into a winner in three years. I don't know that I would brand it a total failure, but it will depend on what it looks like at that point.

Dave Trembley is the George McClellan of managers. "Little Mac" was great at building an army, but he stunk as a field general. Dave's great as a teacher, but his on field skills leave a bit to be desired. Of course, that's easy for us to say, but you lose patience after 12 years of futility. Nice job by Berken though, I know a lot of people who post here who were predicting Berken would have to be admitted to the hospital by the 2nd inning to treat a wrenched neck from watching so many line drives sail out of Fenway.

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Pete's reply: Hey, don't go trying to take this blog to a higher intellectual level. Not cool.

Oh, one more thing. I scratch my head about those posters who continue to lament Andy MacPhail and "the plan." "Do you think the plan is still working?" "We have to change the plan"...Well, what do you suppose we do? Go back to signing free agents left and right like we did in the late 80s (Don Aase and Lee Lacy anyone?), losing out on draft choices as a result? What else can we do other than what Andy is currently doing, i.e. buildup the farm system, continue to make smart drafts and smart trades. Look at what we got for George Sherrill--Josh Bell is launching pitches into the ionosphere left and right and Dave Johnson's kid just got named Pitcher of the Month. I mean, we love George, but he wasn't going to bring us a pennant. It's a trade to build the farm system and that's where you get the pitching and defense you crave and require to build a strong foundation. "Build the arms, buy the bats," is a good plan if you ask me. Andy's a sharp baseball man from a long line of baseball men, it's clear he knows what he's doing (Robert Andino for Hayden Penn? Felix Pie for Garrett Olson? Anyone want Penn and Olson back? Anyone??), let the man run the club, hope they move Trembley to head up Minor League Operations (DT, go teach the kids down on the farms, that what you do best), and stop the incessant complaining. Things. Will. Improve. GO O's!!!

"As for Luke Scott...the guy was on fire, found his stroke before the All-Star game, but has been completely dissed and more importantly, marginalized by DT."

Posted by: Dennis | September 10, 2009 8:04 AM
________________________

Someone's blaming Trembley for the fact that Luke Scott is one of the streakiest hitters in the game. Now I've heard it all.

First off, Luke Scott had been hitting 6th all year and he didn't get moved to the 7th spot until he went something like 1-40 after the ASB.

Second, here are some samples for you:

Luke Scott - 2008:
April - .281
May - .212
June - .333
July - .185
August - .326
September - .181

Luke Scott - 2009:
April - .260
May - .432
June - .259
July - .213
August - .230
September - .095

And keep in my, this is not some 22-year-old who's trying to find consistency in the majors. This is a 31-year-old who, even in an off the charts year in 2006, hit .388 in July/August and .259 in September.

Luke Scott is a streaky hitter. Anyone who blames Trembley for Scott's struggles has clearly lost his grip on reality.

Higher intellectual level? On a fan blog? Yeah, you're right, what was I thinking? Some of these guys are still trying to figure out that whole left-right-left-right walking thing...and don't get them started on knives and forks, that's why they only serve hot dogs, peanuts and nachos at the ballpark...

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Pete's reply: Unfortunately, I'm the one trying to figure out the left-right-left-right walking thing, but I think I'm getting this ugly boot off on Monday.

Re: losing the ugly boot (no, no, calm down everyone, the Red Sox have NOT cut Kevin Youkilis), that's good news. Where'd you get your treatment? Foot and Ankle Institute at Mercy is the best around I hear, as Nolan Reimold might attest!

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Pete's reply: Hopkins Sports Medicine. Outstanding in every respect.

Gee, I thought the genius of managers was to identify and use a player's strengths and play to them. Precisely because Scott is a streaky hitter is why he needs to be managed. Benching him in the midst of a tear, promising him to try 1st base and then pulling it out, batting him 6th then 7th, and ignoring him in all discussions of O's futures might have an impact. He looks lost at the plate and we all know he's better than that. Pie and Jones get all the attention, meanwhile Scott goes uncoached and gets to set the table for...Izturis. A good manager would have a plan, a role, a strategy for the leading power hitter on the club. At the risk of losing any more of my slipping grip, pls check homers, rbis, runs per at bat.

CB Coach as to our discussion yesterday on roster increase. No I don't want MLB to change the rules just for the Orioles. The Orioles situation is not unique. Starting pitching is considered good if you get 6 innings which has meant over the years that middle relief and really relief in general has been used more and more accounting for the rise and fall of reliever after reliever. Sure, having really good starting pitching and top notch run support and really a good closer like the Red Sox, Yankees, Angels, the usual suspects, makes fair to good relief pitching sufficient. The rules ought to take into account the entire league not just the big spending teams. There are too many minor league pitchers in the major leagues and MLB's rules ought to recognize this and adjust accordingly.