Wow Pete, up a little late aren't we? What do you think about Trembley bringing up just pitchers when the minor league season is over? Why do we need anything other than some extra protection in the bullpen and another starter? Maybe Turner, but even with him it seem a little unnecessary. Andino hasn't gotten much playing time at all, and it'd be nice for him to start a few games at the end of the season, spelling Izturis and Roberts. Wieters and Moeller are fine behind the plate. Mora, Wigginton, Scott and Aubrey make up the corner infield positions. Scott can also help out Reimold at left while Fiorentino can cover for Pie and Markakis. Why not bring up some of the hot relievers at Norfolk and let them pitch an inning or two every couple games - just using who is hot and leaving them in there?

Yeah, when WE write that they might lose 100 games we're just "hating"...

.............................................................................................
Pete's reply: Yes, but you've been saying it for years and it hasn't happened. Timing is everything, my friend. Stay thirsty.

Maybe 100 and now that I think about it why not? Looking ahead, however, it will be interesting to see what roster adjustments are made in the off season. The Orioles need to add two or three big bats but at what cost? If Jones and Wieters don't show vast improvement at the plate, however, this team may again be facing 90 plus losses next season.

A letter for Mr. MacPhail and Angelos.

Dear Mr. Angelos and McPhail,

We are sure that this off season will be filled with exciting off season deals that will help bring a winner to Baltimore. We are not going to suggest who you bring here, you know better than us what players will fit here, we mean look you brought Pie, Izturis, Jones and a few others..However last off season bringing starters in like Koji, Eaton and Hendrickson did absolutely nothing to protect the young arms of the organization. We would hope you look at starters that can help protect the young pitchers and put some of these young arms in long relief or spit starts. It was entertaining for us to see all the young arms come up and it was a nice treat, in what has become the most dismal season in 21 years. Another thing that the fans see is the lack of a qualified cleanup hitter that can consistently drive in runs, please if you get a chance to address that need in the off season, that would be appreciated.

Yes a lot of us are complaining, asking for the firing of everyone from the players, base coaches, manger and yes some have even asked that both of you relinquish your duties. Really we do not want that. at all. We just want to see a winner next year, 81+ wins would be nice, and we would consider that a major step forward. We would come to games, watch TV and listen to the radio, if you can find a way to bring in a proven run producer and a few starters that can pitch and protect these young arms that would be great.

Mr Angelos, we know you have spent great amounts before on players, and yes we know you were burned many times, but if Mr. MacPhail can have a budget increase of about 50 million a year for the next five years, we have faith that he can pull of some kind of deal that would fix these issues.

Mr MacPhail, the only thing we as fans ask is that you do not retread players, like Huff who we liked, then really hated ALOT, then liked again and then really hated. We cannot go through that kind of emotional turmoil again.

Mr Angelos, we know Mr. MacPhail is one of the hardest working men in baseball and you are one of the greatest attorney's of our lifetime, at least top five. Please honor our request and we will all come back. Peter, do you mind if we call you by first name, do you remember those empty seats used to have someone sitting in them, yes it was us, we just found other things to do, really not a bad thing. Gave us a chance to explore other things from April through October, well to be honest we had nothing to worry about in October in sometime, we just went to the other end of the parking lot, and I am sure that is a thorn in your side.

Sincerely,

The Baltimore Oriole Fans Around the world.

PS. Whatever you do with Mr Trembley is your decision. Face it if you had a manager that had world series experience, he would have probably resigned by mid season, or had high blood pressure, or turned to the bottle, or all three. Really you have to admit you gave him nothing to work with. Like sending a bunch of non ballerina's, with two left feet to perform the Nutcracker at the Kennedy Center in December, it just could not work, no matter how good the choreographer is.

Brian Roberts comments were a little bizarre, comparing the O's to the RedSox if both miss the playoffs/what's the difference etc... Roberts is showing that he's become accustomed to losing, there's a real big difference between losing 100 games and 70. For one, at least the Boston fans have something to cheer for, for most of the season. In contrast, we O's fans are left with small consolation prizes such as Roberts hitting 50 doubles, Pie's cycle and maybe/just maybe our starters will emerge.
Sure, 100 losses is 'only' a number but like a 20 game loser, it symbolizes futility. A couple of 100 loss seasons in a row and it's also a sign of a consistent loser-see Nats/Royals/Pirates.
So yeah, we get a pass this year if we lose 100(or more) which looks more and more like reality but there better be some improvement next year. Fans can only be expected to be patient for so long.

Pete, Don't you sometimes think that without a Cap that baseball feels like Pro Wrestling? I can't help thinking that it would be better for all if Texas sweeps us and maybe beats out The Sox. What kind of sport makes fans root against teams as much as their own? I have as wealthy cousin who is best friends with Selig's wife. Maybe I should tell her how low baseball has fallen.

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Pete's reply: If Bud could get a salary cap, he would. They shut down the game and cancelled the World Series trying to get one in '94.

Rebuild: To Repair. To dismantle and reassemble with new parts:, as in: to rebuild an old car. To replace, restrengthen, revise, reshape, reorganize.....

Unfortunatley, there is no blueprint to rebuild a baseball team that will guarantee an outcome. As I said in a previous blog, the given in the equation is the process itself. The variables are the rate and success of the development of the young talent being acquired by Macphail.

This is a fluid situation and in many respects Macphail is making it up as he goes along, therefore there is no timetable for success in the form of winning.

It is difficult to guage where in the process we are, but we we can see is that on the field the team appears to be moving in the wrong direction.

It should work eventually. Now go look up the definition of eventually in the dictionary.

The Turdland Shuffle

We are the Orioles Shufflin' Crew
Shufflin' on down, losses for you.
We're so bad we know we're doomed,
Blowin' this season like you knew we would.
This losing business is no fun.
We're getting shafted by everyone.
We came here and started to stumble,
Hey O's fans this is the Turdland Shuffle.

Peter Angelos

I'm old man Pete, I only care about money.
Cheer up fans, I'm tryin' to be funny.
I've owned the O's for quite a while,
Making Benjamins and doin' it in style,
Some playa haters say I'm overrated.
Guess what chumps,
I made Sports Illustrated.
I didn't come here lookin' for trouble,
I just came to do The Turdland Shuffle

Andy MacPhail

Well, they call me Mac,
the Mac daddy Fail,
Runnin' this ball club straight to hell.
The club has been suckin' since spring trainin'.
Can't wait to see the season endin'.
I'm a bad dude, I'm the man,
Don't worry fans, I've got a plan.
I am a smart cookie, I don't crumble,
I'm the genius behind the Turdland Shuffle.

Dave Trembley

This is D.T, they call me the Hamburglar
I like bacon, and chilly-fries with my burger.
I eat all day and toot all night.
God Damn Juan, bring me my pie!
I hear I've pissed off lots of fans.
I hope they're not makin' any World Series plans.
No MLB manager blows a game like me,
My Turdland Shuffle will set you free.

Juan Samuel

I'm Juan Samuel, the Windmill man.
I love A-Mac, because he has a plan.
I'm at third base swingin' my arm.
I generate more wind than a windmill farm.
I'm a straight shooter, I aim to please.
Felix Pie doesn't belong in the big leagues.
He can't turn a single into a double.
To catch me doin' the Turdland Shuffle.

Tom Davis

I'm Big Tom, the MASN dude.
Spinnin' it up, like you knew I would.
I'm slick and smooth as I can be
No one does propaganda better than me.
Some guys are jealous
Of my style and class,
Guess what fellas, I have a big a$$.
Whoever ate my doughnuts, is in big trouble,
I bought them today for the Turdland Shuffle.

Buck Martinez

They say Big-T is our man.
If Tommy can't spin it, I sure can.
This is Buck, and it's no wonder
I just saw Pie commit another blunder.
So bring on the Yankees, bring on the Redsox,
The MacPhail plan is gonna blow your pants off.
Check out Adam blowing a bubble.
I'd love to see him do the Turdland Shuffle.

Jim Hunter

I'm Jim Hunter, and I play it cool.
I'm a butt kisser, and my glass is always full.
Under the boss' desk I get on down.
Everybody knows I don't mess around.
I can spin sports news
Any time of day.
This is my real hair, it's not a toupee.
So please don't playa-hate because I hustle
'Cause I'm just here to do
The Turdland Shuffle.

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Pete's reply: I feel a little left out.

Pete, I'd like to know more about league owners and what prospects there might be for a return to the days when every team played every other team roughly the same number of times, or -- gasp -- a salary cap or something like it.

I'm sure the prospects right now are dim, but I'm really just curious. Are all the owners as pleased with the status quo as I'm sure John Henry, the Steinbrenners, Arte Moreno, et. al., must be? Is there any distant momentum building for parity measures?

Has anyone read anything written this year that would shed real light on this? If not: Pete, do you think this is worth looking into during the offseason?

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Pete's reply: During the spring, I talked to some people -- including Angelos -- and heard some grumbling about the economic disparity. I'm sure there will be some clamor for more payroll equity in the next labor talks, but I haven't heard anything about going back to a balanced schedule. That would certainly help the Orioles on the field, though I don't know if anybody in the AL East would vote for it because of the money they make from those big Yankee and Red Sox crowds.

Hi Slugger, very entertaining and clever. However how about giving some people a break, Jim Hunter does not go under a desk, at least I do not think. I challenge you to do another rap without the negatives and talk about what you would like to see next year.
You have to use the following words:
Like
Future
Bright
better
happy
good
great
winner
birdland!

Cannot use turdland, sucks,
Good luck!

It's looking very likely that the O's will lose 100 this season. AM has obviously given up on any attempt to do anything positive for the remainder of this year. All that's left is to see who can make an impression for next season. I'm in favor of shutting down the best young prospects and instead letting some of the guys who've been toiling in the minors for a few years without ever getting the call get a shot, like Mitchel.
It's not like there's any risk to letting them get a shot at the bigs now, the season is shot, and you just might discover a diamond you've been overlooking. Bringing the youngsters up into the horrible atmosphere of a club on it's way to losing 100 games isn't going to help their development any, and they'll get their chances in the spring. So why not let some of the journeyman minor leaguer's get the chance at the brass ring? At least they'll be grateful for the opportunity, and motivated to win, and the fans will have someone to actually cheer for, who doesn't want to see the underdog get his chance? Any chance of that at all, or it will be just more of the same old "never try anything different" philosophy shared by every GM in the game.

Losing Huff, and losing Jones, the way each was hitting, should only benefit the lineup. So should not be used as an excuse.

Losing Sherrill probably does affect the win loss record somewhat.

Shutting down some young starters, though it may cause interest to wane, should not affect the record negatively. So many arms available in Sept, it should be a wash.

Losing Trembley and windmill Juan will help next year, but i agree with poster above that Wieters bat and Jones strike zone recognition are alarming.

Particularly Jones. It will be interesting to see how he approaches at bats next year. And where he hits in the batting order. It seems that Trembley moving him to third might have started his funk back in June. Cant hang that on Trembley though, it was a logical move at the time.

"Roberts is showing that he's become accustomed to losing, there's a real big difference between losing 100 games and 70."

At the same time, the point is to make the playoffs and win a championship. It isn't to win 80 games or to just be competitive. That means you have to keep the big picture in mind instead of looking at just the short term.

That means you can't just overpay to sign a few free agents even though they'll help your team reach .500 next year if that means you can't get that free agent that you'll need if you want to make the playoffs. It means you can't pay $18 mil a year to get that veteran starter if you think that you have young elite pitching that's nearly ready for the majors.

Peter, go back to the Ravens; you are NOT an Os fan!

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Pete's reply: I am neither an Orioles fan nor a Ravens fan...and stop calling me Shirley.

JBear,

How do you know Peter is not a fan? His job is a reporter and blogger of the team.

Do not read too much into statements.

Slugger,

I definitely appreciate the creativity on that one. That being said, I like CB Coach's request too. If only I had the time today..

_______
100 losses has been something I didn't really want to see happen this year. In the end though, it doesn't bother me too much. I know that makes me gutless and a failure in life or something, but at the end of the day there are 24 teams that get a headstart on planning for the winter meetings and only one GM gets to attend those meetings with a smile on their face.

At the end of the day everyone starts with the same record next April and 100 wins or 100 losses in the year before aren't relevant. Just ask the '98 Orioles team.

Dan Uggla of the O's? You now why he called out his teammate, he wants to win and lossing sucks.

Do the O's even have such a person? If they don't they need to get one or two or 25, whether they're a home grown prospect, a free agent, or via a trade, they need a leader. (I know you can't 25 in your face teammates) Is anyone on the current roster, capable of calling out a fellow teammate for being a "Panzie," in public or behind closed doors?

Right now the O's have a bunch of follower's, and no leaders.

We play our last game on Oct. the 4th. Why so long? Game 7 of the world series will fall on Thanksgiving day. Tripp [ your school, we let go ] had a pretty good year at Junipter. Your other boy Blake did well also this year. Billy Rowell needs acupuncture.

Pete-
Because the O's have committed to letting matusz and Tillman finish their seasons early, will other prospects such as Erbe, Arietta or Snyder play if the O's don't seem to car how many losses they end up with? It seems to make sense to let these guys get a month long taste and see what they got instead of bringing up journeymen like Waters. Just a thought

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Pete's reply: No, those guys won't come up for the same reason Matusz and Tillman are going to be shut down. They've already pitched enough innings this year.

slugger, that was great, the only bad thing was that you left out buck's buddy gary thorne

100 losses,

Um in Baltimore we don't call people out. That's scapegoating in these parts.

You are right though. That's why I would rather have had Millar than Wiggy this year. He's one of the few who could pull off some of that tough love.

The Orioles are 14-32 (.304) since the All-Star break. If that continues for the next 28 games, they will win 8.522 more games. With rounding, that barely makes nine, or a 63-99 final result. That's four wins better than I predicted.

Brian Roberts says, "It's just a number." Since the O's have been out of contention for a playoff spot since ... whenever ... does that mean his play and his team's play also doesn't matter since that date?

Maybe it was just the Gatorade talking but his value in the trade market might be better now that he has a signed contract. It's nice he's home-grown and visits hospitals and all that, but the submissive tone of his seems perfected.

I get the deal. We were poorly run for about ten years mainly due to the GM's not having autonomy. Now I see that the new GM is running things as they should have been done since 1998 and I see signs of progress.

Here is my overwhelming concern. I see Tampa Bay lose for ten years while collecting high end talent at the top of the draft. The net result was a near World Series miss. Now however I see them have their playoff spot purchased away from them by the Yankees. This in turned prompted them to sell off a good part for marginal prospects to save money, would the Yankees or Sox have done this?

I see a Toronto team which in most any other division would have been a playoff team these last few years, in this division they were also-rans and gave away one of their better players to save money. Would the Yankees or Sox have given away their starting right fielder? Even if they did they would have the money to buy another.

So what is the end game here? We piece together enough prospects and maybe we go to the playoffs for a year if everything breaks right or we fall short somewhere with a mid 80's win total and we have to start this all over again?

Sure its still fun to sit outide in the summer and take in a ball game but there is something inherently wrong with a sport that would allow one of its top ten teams pour nearly half a billion dollars into its product. MLB Baseball is broken, I never thought I would say that but its true.

Pete -

Totally unrelated comment here, but...

Is Brandon Waring still playing third base? If so, do you know anything about his defense?

If he knows how to use a glove, that .273/27/95 line (in Frederick and Bowie) looks even better.

..............................................................................................
Pete's reply: He played about half of his games at first and half at third. At third, he averaged an error every 12 chances, which isn't very good.

Slugger

Awesome job hahahaha You could of had Wiggy's dad in it though and Gary Thorne talking about Moxy or something lame oh maybe the talent scout that signed cla meredith... heck just use anything they have used for that rounding the bases segment they do on Thursdays lol thats prime material.

I would love to hear somebody on MASN speak their mind about the Orioles for once. Palmer is the only one on occasion but even then like everyone else they are super critical about other team’s problems and passively dismiss the Orioles problems. If they do bring up the Orioles horrible stats they don’t go in depth into the situation like they do to other teams and then they act like they are in this fantasy world like everything is okay. The attitude at the warehouse needs to change heck they need to sober up and get back to reality.

some great comments today! I've got a few blvits. 1) TO MR ANGELOS: When you are dead and gone no one will remember you as the guy who made all the money; you will be the guy who killed the spirit of the Orioles. Does making $800M instead of $600M make any sense if you will be known as a loser? 2)Is my eyesight shot or were the Yankees pitchers getting 6-8 more inches than the Orioles. Since the Yankees have everythiong else going for them, surely baseball could see that the umps aren't cheerleaders for them. The other night the ump nearly brok his arm with the flair with which he punched out Scott; the next inning he was allmost aolgetic with his wimpy strikeout nos the the unfortunate Yankee, 3) TO Mr McPhail; I loved Lee McPhail and don't think that he would find the endemic losing philospohy pervading the team and city to exist EVEN during a building season. Humiliation is not partof rebuilding. If you field a Triple A team why are they playing in the majors and why am I paying for it.4) The only breath of fresh air is Palmer's truthful observations; why is he the only person in the public arena who does this? 5) Even when we lost, I used to like sparring with Yankee and Bosox fans; now I have no comeback whatsoever. The Yanks and Red Sox refer to us as their "get-well" team; can you spell HUMILIATION?

Ron,

John Miller spoke his mind and ended up on the West Coast as fast as you could say Peter Angelos. Davey Johnson spoke his mind and was fired just as he was named Manager of the year.

If our Leader Pete really spoke his mind he would end up writing sports columns for the Howard County Times. Now, to be fair, Pete has come really close to speaking his mind and as a result keeps his personal office effects in cardboard boxes at work.

I have it on good authority that anyone at the warehouse who speaks his or her mind {I know one first hand} is asked to clean out their desk.

We, the informed fans[and reading the bloggers over time I can vouch for the fact that the people who post here are informed} know what we see. Watching the MASN boot licking sycophants try to make chicken salad out of chicken **** nightly insults our senses. But unemployment is nearly 10% and they have traded in their integrity for a paycheck. I guess I can't blame them.

Just one time after another humiliating loss, I would like to see Jim Hunter look into the camera and say "Folks, This baseball team shouldn't be in the American League East. They should be in the Atlantic League where they can compete. They stink. They suck. Goodnight form MASN, and goodbye".

And to poor Tom Davis I say, you were a nice honest young kid when you were selling Ameche Powerhouse sandwhiches for the committee on the Buddy Deane show. What do they have on you?

.............................................................................................
Pete's reply: Gil, if Peter could have gotten me fired, he would have done it long ago. I can write whatever I want. I have absolutely no connection to the team. I've got no problems with your opinions here and they are welcome, but I have to call you out the same way I do Bob and Burt and some others. When you imply I'm afraid to rip the Orioles, you insult me and question my integrity. I write what I want to write. The fact that it isn't as negative as some people would like is their problem, not mine. I let everyone voice their opinion. I argue with them sometimes, but don't try to tell them they should believe exactly what I believe. Whether you want to believe it or not, I think the current program is the only way the O's are going to dig out of the hole they are in. I've seen all the other methods and attempts the past 12 years and all of them made things worse. So I'm on board until MacPhail has sufficient time to have a chance to succeed. If he fails, I'll say so, but nobody rebuilds a trainwreck like this in two years.

MePhail needs to come up with 1 Paul O'Neil clone that will not tolerate this crap internally. Give me 1 player that plays with passion on his sleeve...we have 25 real cool, unaffected, "professionals" that don't play the game that way.
Yea...105 losses is something to be cool about! Unable to get 3 outs...cool...unable to hit the ball to the right side with the infield conceding the run...very cool, not signing autograpghs for kids...exceptionally cool, incapable of throwing strikes on a major league team...way cool, trotting across the field thinking there are 3 outs when there are only 2...beyond cool, & the list of Oriole "coolness" goes on & on & on. We are certainly the coolest team to hit 100 losses in years. Nick Markaikis dive for a catchable ball in foul territory to get a 3rd. out...no way, diving is not considered cool these days. A half hearted effort with the shades up...cool. Melvin Mora understanding why he's not in the lineup when barely hitting .250 & virtually no homers or RBI's...not cool, projecting blame toward his manager for all his troubles...serious cool.
Last thing, John McGraw, Earl Weaver, Jim Leyland or Whity Herzog couldn't do any more with this rag tag assembled bunch of losers than Trembley has done. If Trembley goes...MePhail should be right behind him because he's the master of this domain...this gutted franchise once known as the Baltimore Orioles...the "coolest' losers in professional sports.

Dennis,

I'm going to take on your ---

4) The only breath of fresh air is Palmer's truthful observations; why is he the only person in the public arena who does this?----

That is because he is the only one whose tongue MacPhail cannot control. Even in Chicago, MacPhail was well known for running a well tuned propaganda machine. He was the man behind the curtain who funneled his ideas through only "trusted" beat writers and media clowns. This is well documented in books such as "Entangled in Ivy" and "The Cubs: The Complete Story of Chicago Cubs Baseball". This is vintage MacPhail for those who have followed his career.

"It's just a number," said Roberts. "You don't make the playoffs, what difference does it make? In the long run, if Boston were to miss the playoffs, they didn't have any better year than we did. I don't think the number 100 really matters to any of us. Maybe, if we lost more than any team has ever lost, it would matter."

How dare Mr. Roberts put things into perspective. All of these "genius" O's fans have made it clear that a 100 loss season is worse than a 90 loss season, etc. Don't you dare talk that gibberish to us Brian!

Hopefully all you whiny idiots will read this and get the hint that this year has been valuable for evaluating young talent and getting guys some experience.

Speaking of numbers: The Orioles have experienced 12 losing seasons in a row, and have had 18 losing seasons in their last 24. Spread that out over a century, and you have nearly 80 losing seasons in 100.

If a business were to experience a similar diminution in quality, it would be thought to be in a death spiral. Think General Motors. Think Chrysler. Think Northwest Airlines. These businesses have lost the TRUST of the consuming public. It will be difficult if not impossible for them to recover this trust. Baseball has reminded us, time and time again, that it is a business. If so, the fans are consumers of the product.

If the Orioles were a publicly traded stock, I would not buy them based upon their current earnings potential.

Fans are right to be skeptical. Folks can write dismissive, even derisive comments here and there about whining, but nothing changes the fact that the burden of proof is on the Orioles to demonstrate that the future will be different from the past. This burden has not been met. Indeed, the Orioles have not come close.

Anita Marks was hired to dumb down the Baltimore fans even more with the MASN machine. Has anybody actually watched her on MASN or heard her on the radio? HILLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLARIOUS!

Slugger

You go over the top on this blog quite frequently but I have to give you credit for bringing up Entangled in Ivy. The book has become even more relevant not only for cub fans but for agonizing Oriole fans. However you look at the Orioles current situation Entangled in Ivy is required reading for the coverage of the last disappointing AM era.

Bryan,

Wow! Your perspective is an eye opener. I never thought of it that way. (I'm not being sarcastic).

Now standby as some genius nitpick/down play/compare/contrast your perspective with some simpleton unrelated analogy between sports and life.

Ron,

I agree. It's a must read. Here are a few quotes from the book. The parallels between the Cubs and the O's are striking:

Chapter: The Paradoxes of Andy MacPhail - Excerpts from the Book 'Engtangled in Ivy' by George Castle

Quote - "Armed with perhaps three times the resources in Chicago, MacPhail failed to develop a winner with 5 seasons of 94 or more losses - unprecedented for a modern big-market, big-budget franchise"

Quote - "While achieving smashing success in marketing, attendance, and other financial yardsticks, the Cubs would lag behind other big-market teams in player payroll, position players, produced by the farm system, and baseball operations staffing" ...

Quote - "He was a man who could have articulated his plan, if he possessed one ... however, he preferred his subordinates speaking for him, abhorred sports talks shows, and chose to funnel his thoughts to a small group of traveling newspaper beat writers through whom he could control his message"

Quote - "One of his managers, Don Baylor, could not wait to end his daily media sessions and had mediocre communications skills"

Quote - "Twins' nucleous had been developed before [MacPhail's] arrival as GM by an executive named George Brophy. MacPhail never denied that fact".

Quote - "' 'We put an emphasis on pitching throughout our system', MacPhail explained. One of our problems was pitching we thought we had, but we never completely got. Either it never developed the way we thought, we traded it off too young, or it got hurt ....'We have done a poor job developing position players" ---

Quote - "Interestingly, being a pitching-oriented organization was the only response MacPhail could give when asked to define a 'Cubs Way', if one ever existed .... No one really knows what the organization stood for"

.............................................................................................
Pete's reply: C'mon. First, you discount his success in Minnesota, which included two World Series. So, what happened before he came mattered more than what he did when he was there. Now, you discount what came before him and blame him for it. Nice consistency. The fact is, the book you're quoting doesn't reference the fact that MacPhail had much more success in Chicago than the Cubs had before he got there. He also got them within a deflected foul ball of the World Series -- and they still haven't been there since 1945 in spite of a new management and a name manager who now is accepting the blame for their failure. By your logic, the Cubs current lack of success is MacPhail's fault, since what happened before Hendry and Piniella is what matters -- like in Minnesota. Only now, in Baltimore, it doesn't matter, since the agenda is to discredit MacPhail either way. Let's try to be fair. I'm not deifying MacPhail, just giving him a chance to succeed. If he doesn't, we'll know it soon enough, but assasinating his character two years into the rebuilding program? If you think that's fair, you deserve to go back to the Sid Thrift era and wallow there for another 11 years.

James C

Who is the Captain of the O's anyway. Has anyone called a players only (come to jesus) meeting, once this year?

How about a couple pitches high and tight to back the hitters off the plate? Maybe the O's won't give up 5 HR's a game. "The inside of the plate is yours, the outside is mine attitude"

What about a backbone, the next time a Yankee's (or any other team) pitcher gets upset when Pie hits a HR off him? I live in SD so I didn't see, (espn only showed Yankee highlights here) did Pie do anything to justify being called out by an opposing pitcher?

If were going to have 1000 losses this, they could at least pretend to be upset about it.

Peter,

You should ask Michael Wilbon of the Washington Post to come on here and talk to the fans about Andy Mac. He is an avid Cub fan and from Chicago and would have some interesting things to say thats for sure :)

You want players that hate to lose with every fiber of their being, not players who express nonchalance at the prospect of losing 100 games.

Until a culture shift occurs in the clubhouse, the names will change, the faces with change, the uniforms will change, but the end result will remain the same.

If you look at any winning ballclub, that team literally has a fire under their a$$. Any player who couldn't care less whether they lost 100 or 90 or 120 games is a disgrace to their profession.

Gil,

So Jim Palmer and Dave Johnson are just working for free now? Because I've heard them both be critical. I've also heard Rick Dempsey agree with Palmer on air. Maybe they cloned those guys and killed off the originals, but I don't think the gustapo is out there.

I also don't think Pete is running the Angelos People's Republic Newsletter here. His employer is the same one who pays Mike Preston to lambaste the Ravens even when they are winning. Given who's more beloved around here, wouldn't they rather risk bashing the O's and kissing up to the Ravens if they were going to be biased to one of them? Tribune actually owns the Cubs (or used to, I don't even know where that mess of a sale is), so if anything Pete would be saying how the Orioles should model themselves after the revered Cubbies.

I still miss John Miller, but I sure don't hear him cranking on ESPN during Sunday Night Baseball. Coward. Every broadcast he should be ranting on their lovefest with Brett Favre that ruined ESPN.com for me all summer or the fact that his employers in Bristol probably buy game worn jock straps from the Red Sox to wear to work.

As for the comments on the boss, does anyone here want to post where they work, the exact names of who they work for and then tell us all every mistake that they and the company have made lately? You don't think you'd get fired for it? That's not an evil Angelos business move, that's just life.

waspman. Re: your suggestion-trading Roberts. There is some merit in that. The current O's aren't going to compete for at least 2 years so the time may be ripe to trade him, especially if we can get 4-5 players for him and apparently we have Turner who could step in at 2b in a couple of years, along with Bell at 3B of course.
There likely isn't much of a market for Roberts however. Sure, he's a decent ballplayer but he's also making 10 mill/yr and most teams are either set at 2B and/or will fill this spot with a far cheaper option.
So Roberts isn't going anywhere and as far as his losing 100 comments, he's probably echoing what most of his teammate think as well. I guess if they aren't bothered, we fans shouldn't be either. 100 is just a number and so is 12(as in 12 straight losing seasons!).
Charles your last post hits the nail on the head. I guess the only numbers some players care about are the ones on their pay cheque...

James C,

You are entitled to your opinion and I respect it. That's what this is all about.

The MASN coverage is just plain shameful and any criticism by offered by Palmer or Johnson is mild and vastly understated.

Miller was canned for telling the truth, not bashing the team. There is a difference.

Most decent employers encourage sugestions and listen to constructive criticism. The Angelos family does not and I know because I have done business with them. It is their way or the highway.

Why do you think they are not carried by WBAL 1090 anymore? WBAL did not meet their outrageous brodcast rights demands so now the Orioles radio broadcasts are carried over a rag tag bunch of little 5000 watt stations that I have to search for three times between here and Harrisburg. WBAL used to go all the way to Reading.

Oriole fans in south Central Pa don't even bother listening trying to find them on the radio anymore.

Try driving up 83 sometimes and listening to an Oriole game and you will understand what I am talking about.

I don't understand why so many people are saying "Poor Trembley" he doesn't have any talent to work with. IMHO the O's have more talent this year than they have had in several seasons. The O's haven't had a pitching staff for years and position wise they are stronger than they have been in years at least until a month or so ago when Andy traded their closer and #4 hitter. They have one of the best young outfields in the majors, a leading second baseman and a strong defensive shortstop. A solid prospect behind the plate who is hitting .260+ and a average third baseman, that leaves only first as a weak area and that just happen. Not long ago i read an article, I believe in the Sun, about the O's solid relief crew and the starter with the addition of Tillman, Bergesen, Hernandez, Matusz, Berkin and Guthrie has been as good as they have had in several years. Yet they only have a .403 W-L percentage which is the worst since 2001. Trembley is a nice guy but he only had a winning record seven season out of 20 that he managed. Does he just NEVER get the talent to win or is thee more to it than just the talent given him?

James C,

I agree with Gil on this one, not only Miller but Brother Lo was fired for being too honest and truthful and was fired.

Lowenstein was really great at keeping it light and would be brutally honest about the team lack of baseball savvy.

Never forget when he was asked about being a DH and what he did to get ready to hit and he stated "I flush the john between innings to keep my wrists strong (fitness tip for designated hitters)."

to c b coach:
sir ,
your are truly articulate and deserving of
both our appreciation and thanks for your exquisite remarks

Why are O's fans such fair weather fans? I LOVE this team. Next year, in late July and early August, you Mary's that are pissing on this team will sing a different song.
We all knew that his year's team would not contend. We all have our differences about DT, AP and the rest. But at some point, we have to start to believe. We have the talent. Instead of just jabbering about Angelos, Trembley and the rest, maybe we should just get behind these young guys. The talent is there, but if everyone keeps telling them they can't win, they will start to believe it, and play accordingy. Bleed Orange and Black instead of just thinking you are smart by saying we will lose.

Joe in DC -

The Rays got marginal prospects for Scott Kazmir?

Check the stats, my friend...

Alexander Torres, 21, was 13-4 with a 2.75 ERA, 149 strikeouts and 80 walks in 147 innings in A/AA ball before the trade.

Matt Sweeney was hitting .299 with a .896 ops, 9 homers and 44 rbi in 211 at bats in A+.

Sean Rodriguez, 24, immediately gives the Rays another middle infielder with serious pop. This guy hit 67 homers over his past three minor league seasons (about 1100 at bats).

That's more than "marginal prospects" for a "good part". That's three damn good prospects for a guy with an extensive injury history and a 5.68 ERA. Plus, the Rays basically have six quality starters in James Shields, Matt Garza, Jeff Niemann, David Price, Andy Sonnanstine and the upcoming Wade Davis. And, getting Rodriguez gives them four quality middle infielders (plus Reid Brignac) that they can use to acquire and other parts they need.

In short, trading Kazmir was a very good plan for the Rays.

Note: Sorry for the rant. But I'm sick of people blaming the Yankees and Red Sox for the state of the AL East. The Red Sox do a damn good job developing players and making trades and then use their resources to fill in the holes. The Yankees are obviously more of a "spend spend spend" team, but they've made some good developmental moves and trades as well. And the fact is, if Markakis, Jones, Wieters, Matusz and Tillman develop into a solid core, Peter Angelos has enough money to fill in the holes.

Felix Pie CF
Nolan Reimold LF
Brian Roberts 2B
Nick Markakis RF
Luke Scott DH
Matt Wieters C
Melvin Mora 3B
Michael Aubrey 1B
Cesar Izturis SS

I have been saying to try this for months it cant hurt to give it a shot.

Thanks Pete,

A story about 100 losses is so pitiful, pathetic and embarrassing, that it would be GREAT if someone on the Sun staff wrote appropriate adjoining commentary about such that didn't come across as if it were proof read by the angelos family.

In one of your recent blogs Pete, you mentioned how fans get in an uproar when the Yanks are in town. That's BS!

Fans in this town are just as pissed off when this slab of a team drops a majority of contest by such huge metropolitans as minn, oak and det. Are you kidding me? This organization shouldn't even mention teams like the Yanks and Sox until they can beat like size (and smaller) markets.

By the way.... brilliant Slugger! If one didn't laugh from time to time at the dysfunction of the warehouse (and friends), one would be forced to only listen to the geeks and freaks who have bought into the 'well, no one expected us to win this year' propaganda.

They are LYING to you people. They lied when they promoted the 'baby birds' years ago, and they're lying again.... AndyMac took 11 years to build the Cubs into anything.... 11 years folks! We're
only in year 2!

Tell the truth Pete! Just do it.... it'll feel good, and people will buy more papers (see the NY Post).

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Pete's reply: Now that you've accused me of lying, please go away. I have only one rule on MY blog. Don't question my integrity. You can say I'm stupid and delusional. You can say I'm fat and ugly. But when you question whether I'm telling the truth, I'm done with you. Goodbye.

What a truly depressing franchise to follow...Tillman looks like goferball delux - other than markakis when was the last time anything that was supposed to be good actually became good? I think Tillman has a lot of upside, but his pitches are far too straight to ever be a dominant pitcher...

Oh my god!!! Somebody needs to institute a salary cap because the Texas Rangers are soooooooooo much better than us Orrrioles SOB CRY SOB WAHHHHHHHHHHHH I wish the Orioles were not poor SOB SOB and oh expansion! Somebody needs to take Tillman out of the game and shut him down! Take him out the game on a stretcher and put him on ice until next season freeze his body like in Alien!

Yep got to give it to the Rangers they know how to draft and hold the right players. Yeah all of them are connected to roids or some kind of BALCO drug that’s illegal or will be illegal soon (See Marlon Byrd) but they seem to have it together for a small market team that nobody goes to watch.

Pete, You are going to disagree with me however: The O's hitting has sucked for at least ten years. Most other teams would have axed their hitting coach a long time ago. I don't know what keeps the King Crow still around. If the players aren't listening to him well then where's Dave's voice. Getting a BIG BAt isn't going to solve the hitting problem, better all around hitting from everyone is what is needed. Team hitting will score runs.
There I said my piece.

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Pete's reply: Fair enough, but did you notice that the O's are ranked fifth in the major leagues in team batting average and total hits?

b: Your owner John Henry suggested last winter that baseball needs a salary cap. Try looking at the situation from the Rays prospective, if it wern't for money would they have done that deal, if they had unlimited funds such as the Sawx and Yankess there is no way they would have. Rather, they would have added players if they had similar resources. The trade may work out for the Rays, those players are not highly rated by Baseball Prospectus, however Kieth Law likes the deal for the Rays long-term. My point is, would a rich team have done this? In the heat of a pennant race?

I am for a very high cap too, the players deserve the money they make. If a team cant make it on 125 million there is something wrong. Its not fair for the Saux to be at that level and add, such high risk players such as Penny, Smoltz and Wagner when few other teams have that kind of financial ability. Not to mention adding Martinez who was another salary dump by a poor team.

Think Angelos should fill in with his money? He simply cant go toe to toe with two teams that charge upwards of three times as much per seat and in the lower bowl of that new softball field in the Bronx its more like twenty times as much per seat. If there were a cap though teams capped out such as the sawx and Yankees would be eliminated from the bidding on players such as Teixiera and Sabathia, that way you redistribute the balance of talent more evenly.

Try to sit down and think to yourself what the disadvantages of being a fan of the Orioles-Rays-Jays are. Step outside your saux universe for once, just because your region of six states has a larger fan base does not entitle you to an unfair advantage in building a team. Just because 10 million people live in New York City doesn't mean they get to make unlimited mistakes with their cash. Try to imagine a league where every team has the same chance to build a winner, that financial mistakes cannot be overcome by spending even more money, that a gluttonous team like the Yankees would be in salary cap Hell like the Knicks for years if not decades, it would be a better league except for a couple of selfish franchises.

Pete:
In reference to Gils' posting, you reply that you've seen the O's last twelve years attempt at winning; seeing only failure. So you're on board that the O's latest strategy is the "answer". Pete, admit it, and bust PA's balls...nothin' is gonna change with PA in control. Com'on Pete, give yourself some credibility. Put in print that PA is the problem. Say it...grow some nads

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Pete's reply: Do your research. I don't have to write that again tonight. You're so far behind that you think you're ahead. I guess I'm just not your one-trick pony. And, if you think I don't have any credibility, you're a fool to be here. Seeya.

I would hate to see the orioles lose 100+ this season. But the reality is that its possible with our tough schedule. We all know that a change in managers likely will be made after the season is over, and hopefully it will be for the best. But some corner infielders and a strong veteran pitcher should be on our radar next off season. I cant even listen to the games anymore this time of year it makes me disgusted the way the O's are playing.

Go ravens!

you know what would be cool Pete? If we lose 100 games this season do a comparison between this years O's and the 1988 teams. I would interested in any similarities, number of rookies started. It might be a sign of hope for next year. I was only 8 then so the only 3 guys I know from that team are Cal ripken, Eddie murray and joe orsulak.

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Pete's reply: I got here right after the '89 season. There are some similarities. They had some good young pitchers -- Olson, Milacki, Ballard -- and a lot of outfield depth. They also had Cal, but not Eddie anymore. But that was more about chemistry, I think.

Gil and even CB (say it ain't so CB),

I'm with you on a boss needing to be ok with constructive criticism from an employee. In the case of Miller and even Lowenstein, they're basically bashing their own organization on the team's own broadcast. John Miller was not fired for scheduling a meeting with Peter Angelos and discussing his concerns constructively. Wouldn't you want your boss to do something if you're co-worker was outside with a bullhorn saying how they thought your office wasn't meeting expectations? Would you pay an employee who voiced his opinions that way as opposed to privately and professionally?

In the case of WBAL, why would you work with someone who apparently doesn't like you? I'd think Angelos was a little bitch if he took that crap from a business partner. Oh and I'm glad you brought up WBAL. It goes to my point on why MASN staying positive is just smart from a ratings standpoint. One question to Pere probably sums it up:

How is Seve Davis doing these days?

Wow I need some sleep...I meant Pete and Steve respectively.