I'm never one to call for anyone's head, but here are my thoughts: I think Dave Trembley does a great job with the limited means he has to work with. On that note though, I haven't seen any evidence where Rick Kranitz has done a good job with the young pitchers. I think he is in the same boat as Mazzone and that the Orioles 'pitching prospects' are really just overrated and overhyped minor leaguers. Also, Daniel Cabrera should be RELEASED, he stinks and I'm pretty tired of it.

I'm sure that Cabrera is not enamored with the way that he has been used or not used. I recall that he threw three great shutout innings against Detroit a week ago this past Sunday. Yet, when the team needed a solid effort from a right-hander out of the bullpen, with a lead against the Red Sox, Kam Mickolio got the call. Cabrera came into that game in the ninth inning, with it out of reach, and proceeded to give up two long homeruns. You could tell he wasn't focused and I'm sure somewhat miffed that he didn't get the call in that situation.

I'm not condoning his behavior at all, but the guy has a point. There have been several times this year where DT has made decisions, backed those decisionsin the postgame after they failed , and then somehow saw the light a few days later. Take the Lou Montnez situation for instance.

Players pay attention to what's being said and done. How can he talk so much about respecting the game, yet allow Ramon Hernandez to continue to play daily when he fails to run out a ball or does not make an effort to block a ball in the dirt.

Personally, I think Dave may be good for the team where it is right now, but I have serious reservations about him being the guy to lead them through a successful playoff run.

I feel like I'm the corporate memory around here anymore, but does anyone remember when the Orioles used to own September? I'm talking about the pennant races in 1973, '74 and '82. The days when guys like Glenn Guillver and Jim Fuller would come up out of the minors and make a contribution to the stretch run. The times when Weaver could say in early to mid September, "If we run the table from here to the end of the season..." and no one would laugh.

No one could have done better with the Os this year than Trembly. For not losing 100 games this year, he should be Manager of the Year. If he doesn't lose 90, they should suspend all the rules and immediately elect him to the Hall of Fame. Give him the extension and move on.

SO what was the beef with Hernandez?I was at the game and watched what happened but couldnt hear what was said
I have been trying to find somewhere what happened but not much has been said/written . I do want to say that most of us tampa fans respected the fact that the catcher was willing to stand up for his pitcher. We Rays fans have been on the wrong end of some bad umpiring and we were by the most part at least empathetic.
Used to live in DC back in the 80's and followed the O's in the Murry Ripken Palmer era . But live in FLA now for 10 years and now follow the Rays.

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Pete's reply: Guthrie was frustrated with some close pitches he didn't get. I assume Hernandez was commenting on the same thing.

peter it is a rotten shame that this is another year where the manager could wind up taking the bump for some disgruntaled players. i think dave trembley has done very good with the hand that has been dealt to him. it has been very disappointing that the pitchers that have been brought up to replace those on the d l.have not stepped up. one would think at least one or two of them would have shown some real effort. the season might have only one month left,but i wonder if a little bit of george steinbrener's treatment might not be a tad bit of what the dr ordered. most likely something like that at this time of year would fall on deaf ears.

Peter,
With all due respect, you are judged on 162 games, not your performance through July. Just about every other manager the Orioles have had over the past decade had 4 months of 'relative' success and then ended the season with a poor record and clubhouse issues.

Trembely has begun to seriously over-manage with his pitching changes. Granted his choices are limited, but so were the other Orioles manager's, and they are almost always back-firing. He is becoming arrogant and condesending to the media as the losses pile-up.

Sure the 2008 season was suppossed to be a washout, and it will be when it ends. Low expectations and ultimately, low results.

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Pete's reply: The difference is, he was given a team that was supposed to win 65 games. Some of those other teams were sold to us as being able to make a run at .500. If Tony La Russa or Joe Torre were judged on how they performed in September with a grand total of one healthy, productive pitcher, they would both be pumping gas right now.

My opinion is that all we have heard this year is how this team, with these players and this manager, is different then the past teams.

Maybe we should let these guys PROVE that they are different before making decisions that could affect the future in the long-term. Another collapse, with complaining players and a helpless manager doesn't suggest change to me.

Lip-syncing to an old song and making the media chuckle in press conferences are nice, but mental mistakes and uncontrolled players and whispering voices would just prove that more changes need to be made, and maybe just because the guys in place are better then before, they are not the best for this team.

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Pete's reply: I don't know if I can say this strongly enough. If this guy doesn't get extended and the team heads into the offseason to do another managerial search, then -- for the first time -- I will finally agree with all the self-fulfilling prophets who think this team will never win again.

I've been an O's fan here in North Carolina since 1971, and I believe getting rid of Dave Trembley would be one of the WORST things the Orioles could do. He's a good man with the passion and burning desire to make this organization great again. Give him and Andy McPhail time; they have a plan so let them see it through to fruition. Maybe it would be best to let the players who whine and moan go somewhere else!!!!!!!

I think he's in way over his head. The day he brings in a right-handed pitcher to face a lefty, based on the history between the pitcher and the batter, rather than just robotically bringing in Walker because the batter is lefthanded, I might start watching again. I'd rather have a computer run the team -- at least we'd get matchups based on logic.

Don't agree with you about Trembley. I do admire the fact that he has gotten more than many of anticipated from some older players like Mora, Huff and Millar. But strictly looking at Runs Scored and Runs Allowed, the O's record as of last night should have been 66-67. In fact, it was considerably worse, 63-70. The margin of actual victories above or below expected victories tells the tale about the manager's decisions. Trembley is over-managing. And I don't get the impression that many of his decisions work out. Yes, he has a team with weaknesses. But we still lose more games than we should because of his decision-making. I don't respect his ability to handle the bullpen or the fact that he insists on playing Jay Payton, when we have a promising but unproven player in Montanez batting 100 points higher than Payton.

In my view, the team will never win with Trembley at the helm.

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Pete's reply: So what you're saying is, he got way more out of the offense than anyone expected, but the runs weren't distributed properly so they won three or four fewer games than they would have if he had both gotten a ridiculous offensive overachievement and managed it better. Isn't that like saying 'Thanks for saving my life, but you messed up my hair."

From the beginning, I thought that any amount of competing this team could do would suffice. I expected them to be borderline-Nationals bad. There have been a ton of pluses to take away from this season. For Mora to do what he has done and last this long into a season without getting injured is miraculous. Considering we all knew from the start of this year that this team would stink and that we had to endure probably two and at least one more season of this tortuous aug/sept/oct crap-fest before our quality prospects would be at the big league level.

I applaud McPhail for building a farm system through the Bedard trade (embarassing how much we stole from them) and the draft. I think that his stance on Trembley, however, is a real travesty. This is a coach who most of the players love. Let's not forget that he really had little to no experience managing at the major league level until two years ago. It took ten years to get to the point when the team was just downright terrible from top to bottom. Let's give this rebuilding process a little more than one season before Trembley is considered expendable.

I cannot say this bigger, louder or more clearly KEEP DAVE TREMBLY AND SIGN HIM FOR TWO YEARS AFTER THIS ONE! The man along with McPhail has started to change the culture of losing around here. The team is going through a rough spot and it should be. Look at the facts:

They've had no SS the whole year and the starting CF has been out for weeks now.

The SPs as a whole have exactly one member of them that has actually pitched a full season and that guy is now hurt. Burres, Liz, Guthrie, Olson and Waters have never started consistently every 5 days for an entire 162 game season. They are going through there growing pains at exactly the time you'd think, especially since they played so far above where we expected them to.

All of these players will either be better for this next year or not here.

Can we look at some positives too???

BROB and NMARK have had solid years again. HUFF and MORA have had renaissances. While his avg has dipped MILLAR has shown that he can get on base and be a run producer when given at bats. RAMON after a very slow start was stuck with by the mgr and now is producing and I don't need to even talk about AJONES' progress.

Lay off the mgr cause it's not his fault. This is supposed to happen and will make the players and the team better.

Pete and Eric in Pitt, I am with you guys 100%, as how the heck can anyone question the job that Dave has done? The guy has a 3 man bench because the "so called" pitchers on this team other than Guthrie, are as reliable as Harvey dent's coin (for you Dark Knight fans out there).

Dave has this team on the right course and I feel sorry for the people who enjoyed the Ray Miller, Sammy P. or Lee Maz years so much more This is the same garbage that we heard about how the Crow was a bum and he needs to be fired, yet not one person will say that anymore. Do you guys watch the games or just read the box scores because I want to know how the O's have remained competitive till late with the likes of Rocky Cherry and Lance Cormier coming out of the BP (sad thing is that other than JJ, they are the only reliable arms in the pen right now and I can't imagine them playing for 80% of the other teams).

No manager could win with this team. The guy has no bench, no pen, no starters. You think Tito in Boston would like to have Waters and Burres pitch back to back games for his club this weekend?

As far as F Cab goes, please don't let the door hit you on the way out, as this guy has done nothing so his complaints mean zip. When Guthrie, Markakis and B Rob all talk trash about Dave, I'll listen, but not from this guy.

not that guthrie didn't pitch poorly, but lets not forget Millar's cute little drop that would have gotten us out of the inning and saved Guthrie about 40 pitches and 4 walks. I've had about enough of Millar. I'm amazed at how his average is so high, I can't remember the last time he had a multi-hit game, and he's made more than one uncharacterstic slip up on defense that has cost us. And is there a streakier hitter than Luke Scott, you can just tell by his body language when he is in a funk.

I was at game Sun and Montanez missed two fly balls in Yankees' 5 run inning.
If DT is bringing "respect," why do O's make baserunning mistakes not tolerated in high school?Or Mora twists his leg because he doesn't know how to run from first to second.
O's offense has been great and above expectations,but you don't see a team that plays D and doesn't beat itself

Very well said.

V.

just one thing: do the orioles have a fairy god mother and if so where can we find her (a genie would work 2)

i agree with Peter...trembley is not
the problem...the problem is he was
given a team that was doomed to
the position they are in...earl weaver
could not have done better with the
players (basically AAA types) that
are on the roster. the manager doesn't
pitch, catch of hit...he has used what
little talent he has well. if they get
rid of him...it just adds additional
years to build a winner.

Don't agree with you about Trembley. I do admire the fact that he has gotten more than many of anticipated from some older players like Mora, Huff and Millar. But strictly looking at Runs Scored and Runs Allowed, the O's record as of last night should have been 66-67. In fact, it was considerably worse, 63-70. The margin of actual victories above or below expected victories tells the tale about the manager's decisions. Trembley is over-managing. And I don't get the impression that many of his decisions work out. Yes, he has a team with weaknesses. But we still lose more games than we should because of his decision-making. I don't respect his ability to handle the bullpen or the fact that he insists on playing Jay Payton, when we have a promising but unproven player in Montanez batting 100 points higher than Payton.

In my view, the team will never win with Trembley at the helm.

I am not saying that Trembley saved my life, but that I am ungrateful because he messed up my hair. I am saying something which makes much more sense. Trembley is a good motivator, but a bad manager. Witness his witless insistence on repeatedly bringing Jamie Walker into pitch in crucial situations to "match up" against left-handed hitters - notwithstanding the fact that the composite of left-handed hitters faced by Walker would be leading the American League in hitting. Can anyone even remember how many game-losing HRs Walker has dished up to left-handed hitters? Certainly, quite a few of the seven dingers he has allowed to left-handed hitters cost us games we might otherwise have won. Trembley's in-game decision-making is appalling. Surely, there is someone in the universe of potential managers who is both a good motivator, and also shrewd enough to make sound, well-informed in-game decisions. In my view, Trembley is in thrall to cliches and trusts too much to abilities of obviously inept players like Walker.

The one thing I will say here is this isn't no ones fault. We were not supposed to compete this year, its a rebuilding year, and it will take much longer. One thing I will say about Trembley is as good as he has been this year, he doesn't manage a good bullpen. He has over used it, but you have to say that the starting pitching hasn't helped. Trembley can win, he is a good manager. It just will take time. Trembley has to learn like any other rookie. Let him alone. In time, he will learn from his mistakes too. Walker will be gone. Daniel Cabrera hopefully will be traded to the national league where he will be better off, and we will have a better team next year. Will we win, who knows, but each year will get better and better.

I'm late to the party (or responding on this post, at least), but I'm surprised at people being so critical of Trembley. Dequincey, your comment on projected wins and losses is horribly flawed. First, a swing of 3 games relative to a flat Pythagorean projection is nothing. It's not much different than saying a .300 hitter has lost it when they've gone 0 for 5 in a game. Second, if you were to really crank out stats you'd find that teams with horrible bullpens underperform their simple Pythagorean projected records. There is NO evidence in the Orioles record that Trembley has overmanaged. In fact, you'd be better off looking at pre-season projections like "PECOTA" done by Baseball Prospectus and seeing how much BETTER the Orioles are than even good models predicted. If we're lucky enough that he stays our manager for a few more years, we have a decent bullpen in them, and his teams continue to underperform what their simple runs scored and allowed would suggest, then you might have some basis.

I cringe whenever he brings Walker into a game, too. But then I ask who else he could bring in, and the only guy I can come up with right now is Johnson. MacPhail did a lot to add bullpen depth (Albers, Sarfate, Sherril, Bierd, Mickolio, etc.), and with good reason. We need every little bit we can get.

Let me see if I have this straight - some of you are bitching about Trembley because Walker can't get lefties out consistently? I got news for you - that's Walker's job. That's why he's with the team. It's Trembley's job to put people in the best position possible to help the team win. When the guys he has available don't do their job he has to figure out how to do things differently, but there are limited options. Walker is a veteran, and isn't affected by a bad outing like a less experienced guy can be, so he can go out there the next time and give you a shot at getting the job done. Every time he fails he does increase the likelihood of not getting back in again in a key situation, but for now he's probably still the best option. Even JJ gives up hits and runs now and then, and he can't pitch every game.

As for Payton/Montanez and Millar - just watch the guys play the outfield. Payton is a legitimate defensive ML outfielder. Montanez is a good stick and an adventure in the field. Payton has been respectable all year as a fourth outfielder, and has filled in remarkably well since Jones went out. Millar is not what you'd like as a slugging first baseman, but he has done a decent job all year at getting on base and playing defense. Fortunately the team has gotten enough power from other positions to help cover, but he still has 19 HR and is fourth on the team in RBI.

If you guys actually owned the team and had to pay for things with your own money I wonder how many of the Steibrenner wannabes out there would be so quick to just throw away assets like some are calling for now. Even if some of them are not producing to cost, there is still the matter of how and where are you going to get replacements. Particularly while we are still in the course of the season.