Obama, Clinton, flag pins, patriots

How many debates is this? Flag pins?
I'm sure that those serving overseas would rather hear when they might be coming home instead of "will the future Pres. be wearing a flag pin".

The fact that Obama took it off shows he CAN think beyond what his silly and desperate campaign advisors want him to.
The only reason it was an issue yesterday was because HQ bloggers seemed to be promoting his wearing it.
And HOW he got it (I'm glad HIlary isn't chasing down the vet to see if it was a plant delivery).
Obama had to associate with questionable folks in Chicago to get going.
Hope he folds into Hilary's campaign soon.

Seems like the word got out to Charlie and George that the Clintons had had enough about talking about real issues and it was time to bring up the flag pin again.

Not only that, but the Ayres question came not from Stephanopolous himself, but from Sean Hannity telling him to ask the question.

When an ABC host goes to a Fox hack to get a question, you have to ask yourself if Georgie is now paying the Clintons back for all that they did for him during Bill's administration.

I watched 20 minutes of that debate and turned it off once I realized that Charlie and Georgie were going to play "gotcha" with Obama during the debate. Even after the Ayers question was answered by Obama, and he mentioned the 2 Weathermen that Bill pardoned, there was no followup from the two moderators to Hillary about that.

And where was Hillary's flag pin???

Charley and George were not wearing a flag pins either... I get tired of these none issues being talked about over and over. Here is an issues, what about how Hillary wanting to freeze interest rates to ease the mortgage crisis... any one who has an ounce of financial intelligence knows this is crazy... No ABC wants to talk about flag pins...

He is 100% correct. This is the type of politics that have given us gridlock in our government. I could care less if he wears a flag pin or not. It's what he can do with the problems that face us now and in the future.

He is 100% correct. This is the type of politics that have given us gridlock in our government. I could care less if he wears a flag pin or not. It's what he can do with the problems that face us now and in the future.

OBAMA WAS AWFUL IN THE DEBATE, we cannot risk our country on him! OUR TIME HAS COME FOR DEMOCRATS TO FULLY SUPPORT SENATOR CLINTON TO WIN IN NOV.
Hillary dominates Philadelphia we now know who won the debate according to our focus group. Senator Clinton is the debate winner, 23% believe Senator Obama won while 50% believed Senator Clinton won. Debate Analysis, 4/16/08
ABC News Political Radar Rick Klein – Clinton is back to the strong presence we saw early in the cycle.
MSNBC News Chuck Todd – Obama ‘did not have a good night. Obama’s answer on Ayers and the flag were simply weak. He seemed unprepared, Kinda surprising because questions seemed to stump him each time.
Atlantic’s Marc Ambinder – Theres no way Obama could have fared worse.
Washington Post’ Chris Cillizza— Obama struggled quite a bit when asked about Rev. Wright his pastor.
New York Times’ Katharine Seeyle: Hillarys in her element as she goes into details. Shes becoming expansive, seemingly in her element as she goes into details; Mr. Obama does not look as thrilled to be still standing there.
Talking Points Memo’s Josh Marshall – Hillary ‘certainly seems more self-assured.'She certainly seems more self-assured on the Iran question than Obama did we could clearly see he was on delicate territory.
Philadelphia Inquirer –Obama is again less certain and rambles again. When asked about the Washington D.C. gun ban. Gibson asks him to deny that he has ever advocated a complete ban on hand guns in 1996. Obama says no. But whatever the truth, no other answer is possible
NBC News’ Matthew Berger – Obama tried to have it both ways with Israel. Obama's answer on an Iranian attack on Israel tried to seem to have it both ways: highlight his support for Israel but not lock him into treating an attack on Israel like an attack on the U.S. But it may have looked more like a no because it wasn't a firm yes. Clintons answers were direct.

That wasn't a debate. It was an ambush.

I think it is highly regrettable ABC chose this path right before one of the most important primaries in this election.

The moderators should lose their jobs.

I was pretty surprised with the first half of the debate, and both Stephanopoulos and Gibson went down a notch in my book. The war, the economy, the housing mess, the price of gasoline and other issues are more important than flag pins, Jeremiah Wright, Bosnia, or Ayers.

The real story here is the embarrassingly poor quality of ABC's effort here.

Why would you ask a dumb question about a man's lack of an American Flag pin on national television?

There were a number of questions asked of this lamentable quality.

One might think Rupert Murdoch himself wrote some of the questions (Sorry, Times, that might touch a sore spot).

It all reminds me of why American is in such a terrible state. The major news media have never covered the war in Iraq or other Bush failures with any degree of toughness and honesty.

My God, here is a man that represents much of what is best in America, a figure of grace and intelligence, and an idiot talking head asks him about his not wearing an American Flag pin!

Guys wearing their American Flag pins gave the world Vietnam, Chile, Iraq, and a dozen filthy little colonial wars.

I think both the Obama and Clinton sides can agree that this was by far the worst debate of the season. Stephanopoulos is more political operative than journalist so we expect these types of scandal-baiting questions from him, but Charlie Gibson I'm honestly surprised by.
Every major media critic - including Tom Shales - is lambasting ABC News for its pitiful performance.

The issue between Obama and flags is a legit one. In the past, he has not stood looking at the flag during the pledge of allegience and National Anthem. During the singing of the National Anthem he had his back to the flag and did not put his hand on his heart. And, of course, we have his wife's comment that this is the first time she has been proud of her country.
These are issues because he is vying to be the leader of this country. Reverence for country and its people is an issue if you wish to lead it.

The price of oil hits another new record. Oil companies continue to make ungodly profits. And while American families suffer, president Bush does NOTHING but laugh while his fat-cat freinds get richer and richer.

The question is not "flag-pins". It is will McCain, Obama or Clinton be any different. I have my doubts on all three of them.

But Obama continues to look like the "least worse" choice.

I looked at the debate a little differently.
Obama, right now or before last night was widely viewed as the presumptive nominee. I think ABC did him a great service by beating him up.
This is how the future debates with the Republicans are going to be. He needed to take some "bitter" medicine to learn how to handle this type of debate.
He will need to shore up and shorten his answers for the next debate. If he doesn't learn from this he may not be the guy.
I heard a couple of pundits talking after the debate and basically said the he doesn't know how to knife fight like Hillary, but he better learn in a hurry.

SHAME ON ABC, this was not a debate.. it was simple a good ol fashion AMBUSH

Indeed when given the opportunity, she didn't go on about making it an issue for or against patriotism. Yesterdays question for Obama stems directly from him not wearing one at the beginning of the primary. When he stood out for not wearing one.

How is it a pitiful performance. Instead of focusing on how their issues are alike, like the back patting debate-the public also didn't like- leaving all the other sensational stuff for the papers to go back and forth on, it gave them an opportunity to face the sensationalism with each present and having a chance to respond in front of a public.

Dear America

Senator Obama's words regarding a portion of America as being “bitter" is accurate.

The Southern Poverty Law Center reports that hate groups have grown by forty eight percent (48%) between the years 2000 to 2007. This is a sign of increased bitterness in our nation. There are twenty six (26) recognized hate groups in New York State alone. Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols are the tip of this bitterness that continues to grow as people lose faith in their government.

The vigilante actions by many on our borders with Mexico with guns in hand against workers trying to find work in America. These actions are being taken by citizens who have lost faith in their government's ability to secure the border. This is the anti-immigrant attitude that Senator Obama describes. The various local municipal ordinances being passed against undocumented workers are occurring mostly in small American communities not in the big cities.

The border was secure until President William Jefferson Clinton signed NAFTA and subsequently PNTR with China. These trade bills destroyed good union jobs with health benefits and pensions here in America. The North American Free Trade Agreement destroyed Mexican jobs and forced this mass migration north.

The New York Times reported that during the Carey Bush election of 2004, working class people were knowingly voting against their economic interests because of their religious beliefs. The “Hot Button” item at that time was Gay marriage.

The media has given a pass to Senator Clinton regarding her lying about her arrival in Bosnia. You do not forget being shot at and certainly not when you are being shot at with an AK-47 with your only child in tow. This is not a little white lie or the result of sleep deprivation. Her statement is a bold and clear lie. Like her husband before her, she is against trade bills until elected. Your key strategist is working to get a trade bill passed while you are opposed to said bill. Why is the journalist community giving her a pass while continuing to attack Barack Obama for what other people have said or done?

It is important to note that after the Million Man March, crime has gone down significantly. Minister Louis Farrakhan was seated at the White House with Ronald Reagan and recognized for using his influence in the Muslim world to secure the release of Lt. Robert O. Goodman on January 4, 1984. He was invited to Philadelphia by then Mayor Rendell to speak and help heal the racial divide; holding hands, singing and lavishing praise on April 15, 1997. On May 5, 2005, former President Bill Clinton praised Minister Farrakhan and the Millions More Movement describing it as a positive idea.

The media has become bottom feeders and have not helped to elevate the dialogue between the candidates. The American peoples’ issues: Jobs, healthcare, social security, education and the war are more important than the mistakes made while speaking since all must admit to doing that.

F. Christophe Silvera, Secretary – Treasurer, International Brotherhood of Teamsters, Local #808 22-43 Jackson Avenue, Long Island City, NY 11101
Tel: 917-297-2241, email: fitzverity@aol.com

The issue between Obama and flags is a legit one. In the past, he has not stood looking at the flag during the pledge of allegience and National Anthem. During the singing of the National Anthem he had his back to the flag and did not put his hand on his heart. And, of course, we have his wife's comment that this is the first time she has been proud of her country.
These are issues because he is vying to be the leader of this country. Reverence for country and its people is an issue if you wish to lead it.

Posted by: John D | April 17, 2008 9:24 AM

Hey, hey John D...
FYI- in oder for your rants to have a modicum of credibility, you need to give some specifics. For instance: when and where was this witnessed?
How many times has it occured? Also, additional evidence would really drive home your accusation; such as links to pictures or videos.
Or are you just making this up?

Someone should tell this woman that John McCain doesn't wear a flag pin.

Neither does Clinton.

So I guess she won't be voting this November.

Good riddance.

Obama, Osuma, and Ole ABC can all go to hell. The American Flag is for everyone. These morons do not have the right or authority to tell others not wear the FLAG. Our freedoms are going because most of American have gone Coward and will not fight to keep our right to Free Expression, Freedom of Speech, and Freedom of Religon. All are going to hell and that is known. Most of the flag haters will cower in the end.