What is wrong with parents? We were having this problem so we subscribed, for about $5 a month to check the activity of our son's use. If we saw use during school he was punished. Guess what? IT WORKS! DO YOUR JOB. It's not the school's job to be parents.

Thank you! I've literally nothing to add other than agreement.

and you wonder why MD school testing scores are low

Back in the fall, I took a cell phone from a student. When I first encountered the young man in the hall I politely told him to put it away and kept walking. As I reached the end of the corridor I looked over my shoulder to see that I had been totally ignored. I returned to where the young man was standing and demanded his phone.
After lamely trying to convince me he was talking to his mother, the phone was handed over; but not before a few F-bombs were hurled my way.
The next day I received a phone call from the aforementioned mother accusing me of not handling the incedent professionally. She's another teacher.

This is a problem. 99% of the time, students texting are off task. It's a distraction. it is the same as if a student came to the door to interrupt another student with a question-- and most of them are like "did you hear about so and so?"

Sometimes cheating or sharing answers-- don't get me started on the incidence of students taking shortcuts to actually doing the reading and thinking.

I don't take the phone unless it is really blatant, because it only leads to paperwork on my part to document the issue, and the administration rarely enforces consequences. Instead, I just give the student a ZERO for the work of the day, so the consequences are in my control and they are real.

Unless we enforce consequences for cheating, tardiness, absenteeism, or any other poor, off-task behavior, we're not setting a realistic setting that simulates the actual workplace that students will have to enter.

Phones in schools are a critical problem. There's a reason why the office has a phone, and students/parents should use it. I strongly agree that there should be a zero-tolerance policy for phones in schools (when did having a cell phone become a right?). I don't buy the "I have to be in contact with my parent/child." I just don't think it's valid to a scale large enough to justify the costs. Dealing with phone issues is a consistent distraction in school buildings across the City, and the escalation that often follows is not justified.

Even with these beliefs, though, I don't think giving a zero is an appropriate consequence. The grade should reflect content mastery. I completely understand the teacher-frustration side, but there's got to be another solution (clean blackboards, detention, letter of apology, etc).

Granted I write all of this while on my phone in the MVA (wasting several hours for my number to be called)....

Bill: I agree, but there comes a point... my grades are built on content and skill mastery. There are enough of them in a particular quarter that if a student is motivated, then one ZERO does not impact the grade that much. In fact, this late in the quarter, one of my students who has a score in the 90s took a 0% on a homework that she just did not do. Her overall quarter average did not change.

What I find is that the same students who are constantly a discipline problem are the same students that are consistently distracted, late with work, missing assignments, failing quizzes, unprepared for class.

This becomes a "talking point" then in discussions with the student, their parent, or an administrator.

The City, as most surrounding LEAs, has a "zero tolerance policy" for electronic devices punishable by up to a $2500 fine. This is (according to BCPSS attorneys) unenforceable. Parents push back, and admin backs down.

On a related note-- I wonder what will happen with this cratering economy. High priced cell phone plans with unlimited texting will fall by the wayside. I don't text, because I don't want to pay the price.

Finally, the increasing presence of devices that will allow access to the internet, camera video, and email is part of the issue. A teacher's classroom is a protected learning environment, and I will refuse the recording of class unless it is an approved IEP accommodation.

Seems pretty simple to me. They cannot/fail to master content while on their phone. Therefore a zero is a just consequence since the material didnt get mastered while texting was happening.

Also....really...Detention? Blackboards? Letters of Apology? I think us teachers know how those alternatives work out. And we also know how effective they are tomorrow when that child takes out his/her phone again.

David, I hate to break it to you, but "we teachers" does include me. In fact, feel free to verify, I used each one of these techniques in practice. I also used a class competition system, giving points for good behavior to the class as a whole. Classes would compete for prizes (by week, month, or quarter) against each other but I could manipulate the points as necessary based on the varying levels of behavior between periods. Most successful management system I ever tried.

Just because something doesn't work for you, doesn't mean it doesn't work. I don't mean that to sound obnoxious, but "us teachers," particularly those who I know are incredible at classroom management at the most challenging schools in the City, employ these techniques.

Finally, I called every parent after school day number 1, again on the Monday of weeks 3 and 6, and intermittently on an as needed basis. I took students' cell phone numbers, often trying to speak to them on their phones outside of traditional school hours to explain why using a phone or acting out was detrimental. Of course it didn't work every time, but that collateral relationship made them more willing to clean white boards &/or attend detention. Talking to them before contacting a parent often yielded more positive results than speaking to the parent at all. Moreover, I learned this from the best management teachers, who almost all suggest and employ these alternative techniques.

You hit a nerve. And I suggest you check your assumptions before making conclusions.

Cell phones should not be used in schools during school hours. My son carries his cell phone, but does not turn it on until the end of the day just as his 2 older sisters did when they were in HS. Rules must come with the use of cell phones and parents need to lay down the rules. Teachers have tried to no avail convincing both parents and students about phone use. Emergencies are to be handled at the office unless of course we are talking about shootings, or anything that warrents a student to call 911.
Discussing your endeavors with a friend who you just saw a few minutes ago about a male/female is not to be a part of conversations in the classrooms at all.
Teachers have enough of a problem just keeping students from excessive talking in class, the phones are just one more thing to deter teachers from teaching and students from learning.
It's an unnecessary headache and should not be tolerated.

Bill-
I trust the veracity of your claims. I do. And to rebut in kind I say this:

I did NOT comment on alternative tactics like classroom points, participation points, incentives for good behavior or my schedule for phone calls home nor the dates and times of those occurences. I commented on the three you mentioned as being a little suspect. But thank you for sharing what worked so well for those requisite two years.

I spoke to this: Detention does not (generally) work because kids do not show up (excuses run the gamut) and we as teachers are often powerless to give additional consequences that fall under the realm of administrative jurisdiction.

Blackboard cleaning, surprisingly, is something my last period kids like to do, so they see it as a reward. Shocking I know, but true.

Letters of apology. Students in my school are required to tell their version of an incident anytime a referral is written. While it is not a letter of apology, students are required to apologize verbally if they are put out of my room before they can re-enter.

I have great relationships with my students, collateral or otherwise, but that does NOT preclude their use of phones and the lack of meaningful consequences administered from the top down. I do my best to deter their use, but incidents still happen. A culture of permissiveness related to phone use in school is something that needs to be addressed at each school.

I have absorbed, used, and not used many of the "best practices" of classroom management-given at the system, classroom and individual level. Not one single one of those practices has successfully eradicated phone use in classrooms.
Feel free to locate one room for me where phone use has been totally eradicated and what was used. I would love to know.

And lastly, you also hit a nerve. Last time that I checked, NOT being in a classroom makes you NOT a teacher. I make conclusions and assumptions because I spend between 8-10 hours each and every day in a school with, live with a teacher who does the same, and spend my free time planning things to help these children succeed. I presume no more or less knowledge than you, but you need to check your own smarmy assumptions and conclusions that are made from an air-conditioned, evenly-heated chair atop the ivory tower.

David - I get what you're saying, and I understand your frustrations. The ivory tower comment, though, is simply erroneous and unnecessary. Would you say that CEOs and Boards of Directors shouldn't make decisions about Walmart's production lines because they don't work in the factories? If so, I follow your logic. No matter where you are, no matter the industry, at some point there are people removed from the everyday who are making expansive decisions. To merely assume that their judgment is wrong based on the premise that they're no longer working the line is insulting.

Regardless, to call a part-time job with the central office "the ivory tower" is sadly mistaken. You quickly dismissed "alternative" suggestions based on what "real teachers" think (your words, not mine). My point, merely, was that "real teachers" are using those alternative methods successfully. Feel free to email me (linked to name), and I'll send you names of specific teachers who feel as though they're having great success on "phone-management." We agree on the basic premise, we agree that no method is perfect. I think it's probably more productive to find value in the work that each of us does to improve schools, rather than point out potential flaws. For my part, I apologize if there was a suggestion that you weren't a dedicated teacher, never was my intention, nor will it ever be.

Point blank: Phones in the classroom are a problem. If there was some amazing point based by the book method to stop phone use... this thread wouldn't exist.

Additional fact: it is illegal for students to bring cell phones into city schools. Illegal. I've tried everything David has, and even what Bill brings to the table. These days I wait for an opportune moment, take the phone, remove the battery, and hand the phone back... this works wonders.

You'd be surprised what intuitive solutions we teachers come up with, Bill, that aren't written in 'welcome to teaching in a city school' manuals.

The solution comes from home. Last time I checked there are a number of cell phone plans that do not support/allow text messaging. Parents can easily have the secure feeling that they can contact their child in an emergency without unlimited text & data plans.

Sorry, one more quick thing to add. Not sure if this adds to the discussion, but interesting none the less. One of the gossipy issues in law schools these days has to do with allowing internet for students during class. Of course, students say it's needed, professors hate it. I tend to sit in the back of class working on City Schools stuff or post on this blog during class, so I know I'm a cause of the problem. More so, I'm paying for class, so in way I'd sort of buy the argument that I'm wasting money.

I bring this up to say that having access to phones at school is as tempting as surfing the internet during class. Were the internet shut-off, sure I'd be upset, but I'd probably pay more attention. With it on, I doubt I'll stop. Point being that if students have access to phones, they'll find ways to use them if the classroom culture and/or school culture don't counter the temptation by simply disallowing them during school hours. As the previous discussion has indicated, I do think there are ways to reduce the use without affecting students' grades, but either way phones are a nuisance for teachers, administrators, and other students.

Here we go with the Bill Show again. I am probaly old enough to be your mother. I do not know what your future plans are but with your attitude, I hope you do not plan administration.I subscribe to the servant-leader philosophy and all this know -it-all talk is insulting, not helpful, stressful, and boring. I thought we were blogging on this site to help each other help kids succeed?

Wise educator - then don't read it. Any time it says, "Bill," at the end, skip over that post. No one is forcing you to read what I've written.

Bill, Your response is exactly what I was referring to and would have expected. That attitude would never foster a positive school environment.However, I will take you advice.

Let's put the pedagogy on the back burner for the moment and think of safety and mob mentality, something to which adolescents with overactive amygdalas (emotional center of the brain) and underdeveloped frontal cortexes (impulse control) are vulnerable.

Texting in class is an easy way for many students to coordinate setting fires, gang up on victims, feed gossip that spreads like wildfire and then flares when the kids get outside, spread rumors, etc. I have seen it at my school. Period.

Last response, I promise, Wise Educator. I'm sorry for the curt answer before, I was typing on my phone while on the bus. I've tried to explain politely a few times my purpose in writing (see later in discussion here and here for a few examples).

In fact, I've felt bad at times in case discussions were becoming overheated, supposing that's possible in blogworld. And I asked Sara if she thought I should cool off writing for a bit. She advised otherwise, so I kept posting when I had free time (aka while in class or on the bus).

Bottom line, I learn a WHOLE lot from the people on the blog (David O, Brandon, Simon, a parent, Steph, vetern teacher, IO, Corey, Ummm..., calamity, and others). My opinions about things have changed many times after reading teachers' & parents' posts. Sure I have an opinion, but I more like the extended discussion to learn peoples' real feelings about schools, students, Dr. Alonso, central staff, teaching practice, etc. Yes, I get offended by the consistent 2-year bash, it's a sore spot because I think it's an issue that deserves more exploration. Either way, I respect the people that say it because I understand where they're coming from. It makes sense, I just wish at times it weren't the case.

In all reality, though, on a scale of 1 to 10 measuring importance (with 10 at the highest), my opinion counts about as much as a 1, maybe a 0.5. In the grand scheme of public education in Baltimore, I'm pretty much as insignificant as it gets. I work hard to produce good work for the central office, but the real work is done in schools in classrooms. I like to present a different opinion because I think getting people talking about education, regardless of whether it's positive or negative, is a good thing, because it keeps attention on improving education for kids in Baltimore.

I'm a former teacher (yes, David & Brandon, former, you're very right), but now I'm a law student and part-time worker for central. At law school all we do is read & write. My life more or less consists of reading, writing, and powerpointing (not a word, but that's ok). Sometimes I can go overboard in writing, and if I had more time, it'd be more concise. I said you shouldn't read it because when I tried to be polite before, it didn't work. So, I guess if I'm going to keep writing, and I consistently bother you with the "Bill Show" then you should skip over it. No reason to let me annoy you, I'm just not that important.

On a different note, I think we should host an InsideEd gathering at some point in the City. Maybe at a school-related event? People like the anonymity, but I think it would be interesting to speak to others face to face sometime. Sara, and others, thoughts? Maybe the writing comes off differently than intended when read, but I have to imagine that the posters here all care deeply about the state of education in the City. A gathering might give an opportunity to discuss ideas for improvement in more detail? Just a thought.

Possession of Portable Pagers
An individual’s possession of any portable pager on public school property is prohibited. “Portable pager” means any device carried, worn, or transported by an individual to receive or communicate messages. Such devices include cellular telephones as well as “beepers.” If any individual is found to be in possession of a portable pager, the school authorities may immediately confiscate the item. Confiscated items should be stored in a secure location, preferably the school’s main office, and returned to the individual at the end of the school day with instructions to not bring the item back onto school property again.

This policy does not apply to (1) disabled students using portable pagers for medical reasons; (2) law enforcement officers; (3) visitors on public school property for any authorized program, meeting, or function; (4) faculty or staff members employed by the school board; (5) members of any volunteer fire department, ambulance company, or rescue squad whom the school principal and the chief of the volunteer fire department, ambulance company, or rescue squad have authorized to possess a portable pager on school property; and (6) students whose portable pagers are contained in vehicles that are on public school property and are not found to be connected with criminal activity.

Appropriate disciplinary action for students found to be in possession of portable pagers may also be taken by the school in accordance with the established rules and procedures of the Board of School Commissioners.

This is taken directly from the City Schools Policies. WHAT is the problem? If a policy exists, why is there any discussion? Enforce it or remove it. Period.

Bill and Wise Educator: I truly value both of your ongoing contributions to the blog. Let's not use this as a forum for personal attacks and instead continue the robust debate that comes from having contributors with different viewpoints. As for Bill's suggestion of a gathering, yes! The Midnight Sun blog had one last week and it went very well. I know, people aren't as concerned about being anonymous about their views on city nightlife as education. But, if folks here are interested, I'd be happy to set something up.

Thanks for posting this, wise educator.

I have long thought the city schools to be ineffective on this issue, precisely because how this policy above is written. First of all, the language is antiquated; it seems like it was written in the mid-1990s. "Portable pager" and "beeper"? Really?

Second of all, it's simply not practical to not allow cell phones to be carried by students in schools. Unless we're going to pat down students who walk in the door, or provide a secure place for confiscated cell phones, it seems an impossible task.

I tire of dealing with electronics so much. It's such a part of the culture, even in the adult world (so many people love Michelle Rhee, but the thing that stood out most to me in that Time magazine profile was her constant use of a Blackberry during meetings). Some days I honestly just feel like throwing in the towel in regards to this issue. Choose my battles.I think right from the top, with the flawed school rule about these "pagers," this is an issue.

I'm tempted to advocate for a cell phone scrambling device in school buildings, except my own cell phone is the only working phone in my vicinity for emergencies or fights, so that would seem a safety issue.

Sara,Point taken! Bill, I appreciate your explanation. I apologize for being overly sensitive. City Schools has a way of making a person sensitive to critical remarks. As a teacher, you often feel like the least respected or empowered person in the system. Maybe it's a bit like the old Norman Rockwell magazine cover where the man gets in trouble at work, etc and eventually he kicks the cat. I kicked out at you. I am sorry. You obviously care and have knowledge that is helpful. I will not skip the Bill Show! :-)
Please believe me when I tell you that I also care! I love my school, my job, my leadership folks, and my kids. I just get frustrated with the world outside my building.A gathering would be interesting although I am still leary about some people knowing who we are. But I would enjoy a face to face as long as confidentiality is respected.

I'm glad the posts have gone down a notch, because I wanted to chime in a little about cell phones. It just isn't realistic with logistics, afterschool activites that may come up at the last minute or get canceled, work that can have a late meeting, different schools and different kids etc for kids above a certain age (I'd say middle school) to be told you can't bring a cell phone into school. Big signs at the door that say turn them off would be fair and I'm all for confiscating them if they get used in the school, but saying "just don't have one" would be a real hardship, at least in our family. Before anyone jumps to any conclusions, my kids don't even know how to text message - they've never texted in class, and their phones are always on silent mode, so they've never had a ringing phone in class.

bmoreteach--
my school DOES pat down every student that enters the building, and cell phones are STILL a constant problem. Our students are geniuses when they need to be. If I see one more phone come out of someone's shoe or underwear...

Parent, I agree with you and the other posters here about logistically banning cell phones. The law in place allows me to legally take the phone if I see it in the class, that much I appreciate (students seem to think they should have the right to keep their property even though they're using it at the wrong time, so the law helps me take action).

Like I posted above. Kids have the phones, I get it. But parents can have 0 texting plans or use watchdog services built into their phone plans. I believe both T-Mobile and AT&T have websites where parents can see how much their child uses the phone, how much they text, and when they do these things. Additionally from those same sites parents can adjust the plan (say remove texting for a week because the child did x,y, or z). I stick to my point: if the phones are going to be in the building the solution must come from home.

Teaching children when and where to use the phones, and then punishing them when they violate those rules should not be something I need to do during HSA prep or my lesson on the Harlem Renaissance. On occasion, perhaps, but not as regularly as I must do it now.

Given the previous rule is obsolete, how about:"Student owned phones must be turned off during the school day (defined as from the start bell to the end bell as well as any after school detention periods). Any phone that is found on or in use during the school day will be confiscated, turned off, stored at the central office, and not returned to the student until the end of the school day. If the same student has a phone confiscated more than 3 times during the same school year (as tracked by the central office when the phone is confiscated) a parent will be called and the phone will be returned to the parent only after a phone policy is reviewed and signed by both the parent and student. These rules do not apply if the student uses their phone to call 911 in an emergency situation."

Taking phones away from kids is not as simple as "You have it out. Hand it over. Get it back later" or revising the system-wide policy. Many (not all) children become very combative when you try and even broach the subject of phone confiscation. Administrators are the only ones with "real" power to get phones from some children, and in my experience, they kind of look at you like "Is this why you called me to your room?"

It then becomes a power struggle. Brandon et al. are right. Starts at home.....familiar phrase.

I'll buy the answer that kids should have been taught this at home and that parents should be the ones policing this issue. Given that that is not what's happening, what's the answer? More communication with the parents? A more proactive and uniform approach from administrators?

I think having a realistic policy isn't a bad place to start. It certainly doesn't solve the problem, but it gives a starting point. Ridiculous rules that nobody follows and everybody realizes are a joke undermines whatever authority is there.

Thanks for the response, Wise Ed. I think we're all good people fighting for a good cause here!

I'm going to have to back up, David, on this one. The escalation is really the major issue. Of course the distraction is bad, it's the asking to take away that often leads to the unnecessary confrontation.

Bill,
you're such a lawyer! Ughh!

My policy on cell phones/electronic devices:

If I just see it out or hear it ring, it's mine until the end of class.
If I see you using it or playing with it, it's mine until the end of the day.
And if it happens again, or if you refuse to hand it over, I turn it over to an administrator and/or call your parent to come get it.

I teach 6th grade, though, so I usually only get token resistance to handing it over. Plus, I have a super supportive administration who would back me up on this.

The kid knows they're not supposed to use the phone at school, so the promise that they'll get it back at the end of class/the day usually gets them to hand it over to me.

(But most of the kids at my school are smart enough to go to the bathroom to use their cell phone and keep it short. Not that I condone that, but at least at that point, it's just the one child off-task.)

Cell phones are a pain. I did a formal observation yesterday and students were texting all through the class. The rule is NOT easily enforced. Some teachers do it more effectively than others. I personally have a problem with them--probably irrationally so--and I make it very clear to any student I deal with that I don't want to see/hear them. Most of them do comply. There is no easy answer but each teacher must find a way to deal with such issues successfully. Many younger teachers do not feel that they have to enforce rules that they do not agree with. The problem with that attitude is that it breeds a general disregard for rules in general. Then, when something serious happens to them, these same teachers wonder why administrators are reluctant to back them up. I think that the School Board needs to seriously update/revamp school rules and policies--not the cosmetic makeover that they received recently. Hey, Bill, how about doing that?

Bill's mention of removing the internet to make him pay more attention to his obviously boring law professor and/or text, is actually a gem. If you've ever been at Digtal Harbor HS-and most of us have- you may have noticed that cell reception is awful. It's very difficult to even get a bar. I don't know if that is intentional or not but I smell a profitable patent. If someone can invent an safe service interrupter-except for 911 calls of course-they could stand to make a lot of money. Just a thought.

And, BTW: If anyone of you gets rich off my idea I want a percentage of the proceeds for life.

A couple of thoughts from another teacher at a VERY challenging county school:

1. I wish my students cared enough about their grade to use phones to cheat! We'll save that topic for another day...

2. We take phones when they are seen/used and will only turn them over to parents - the end. Some complain, argue, whine ... we hand them the BCPS Student Handbook that THEY and the students signed back in August. I understand why the kids have the phones and don't want to leave them in lockers to get stolen. I take the time to teach appropriate time/place lessons for a variety of behaviors - this works well and the students generally appreciate the approach and comply.

3. As with other behaviors - I challenge students to be off task and still meet with academic success. Bottom line - they can't in my room. I let the grade speak for itself, document behaviors and then use them to justify grades given if challenged by parents or admin. Unfortunately, the students are correct. Many classrooms are boring or simply so easy that that kids can be off task and still get decent grades.

And Joe hits the nail on the head - if the lessons were more interesting, more connected to the learner, more at the level of the kids in front of the class there would be less boredom and so it goes. I am not saying the every teacher needs to plan a circus with fire eaters so that every kid is engaged, but I too have sat through enough observations (and heck, classes of my own) to know that I too would get board and tune out.

As for cell policies, no one (except maybe Joe) has talked about making the rules with the kids - making the consequences with the kids and going from there. We have an issue with them (and I think they are unavoidable both as a teacher and as a parent) and our policy (like others have stated) is if we see it we ask for it. If we get it quickly you get it back at the end of the day. If you gave a lot of attitude your parent can come get it. We had more struggle in the beginning of the year when kids didn't trust us and almost no issue with handing it over now. Kids need to be a part of the process and have some trust and faith in you. Those things take time to establish.

Well I agree that texting friends in class is the best way to avoid the boredom of boring lectures. Also it does not disturb the lecturer or any of the neighbouring students.

i think it would be good because it would be more quiet and students would be a lot more focussed to have fun and learn

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