More on arrests at Obama victory party
Did Baltimore police use unnecessary force in breaking up a post-election bash on the streets of Charles Village early yesterday? Or did they answer the calls of angry neighbors and appropriately clear a street of unruley revelers?
Police are defending their actions while others called the arrests brutal. Previous postings on the crime blog and a story in today's Baltimore Sun by Gus G. Sentementes give the back and forth.
There's a series of videos on Youtube and more than 90 people have weighed in on Facebook, and not all agree that police acted badly. Here's a sample from the link:
Virginia Chen of Johns Hopkins University wrote:
As was already mentioned, we have noise laws here, and when you're outside in the middle of the night, being loud and rowdy like a jackass, then it’s no longer peaceful assembly, it’s breaking the law.
Perhaps you think you deserved to be treated better by the cops. What exactly were you expecting? Ten more warnings, some sugar-coated pleading, then bribes of cupcakes and bumper stickers until the last person decided they were tired and wanted to go to bed? Or maybe you believe that a rambunctious crowd of over 200 people should be spoken to with the patience and calmness used when addressing a classroom of schoolchildren? If anyone thinks that they and a handful of their friends (or whoever you think is properly qualified) can more effectively and pleasantly contain and disperse a crowd of that magnitude and state of agitation, I invite you to try. Until then, cut it out with the rhetoric.
People just love to find police brutality where there is none.
Sean Distefano wrote:
This all happened right outside my window. While it was endearing for the first hour or so, the last couple hours got out of hand.
The ambulances that hit their sirens were not joining in the celebration with the rest of the cars, they were trying to get to the freakin' hospital.
When Carrie was telling people to move out of the road, she was as usual trying to help them out, but they did NOT listen and the police took over. I feel bad for the person who got tased, but I think moving out of the way and being quiet after 2 am on a Wednesday was a no-brainer, even before the cops got there.
But Diana Wohler wrote:
Clearly we shouldn't have been in the street, but there was no warning that was made to the entire crowd to get off the street or there was going to be arrests. No megaphone, no anything. The first thing I saw was an arrest, and then I got the hell out.
There was no property damage or vandalism, no breaking and entering, nothing but a spontaneous party in the street.
The taser was completely unacceptable
And one more from Sam Biddle:
The tactics used by the cops last night were shameful. Not a single person walked into that crowd with anything but the best intentions—hugging, singing, laughing, cheering. It was definitely very loud, but I'm so disappointed in the police for not understanding that we were participating in perhaps the most profound political moment of our lives—and doing so peacefully. It should have been tolerated and contained, but not attacked. People being so moved by a sense of shared civic joy isn't something that should ever be suppressed by force.
Below are some photos taken by Zach Warner, who was not arrested but said police officers refused to identify themselves or provide their badge numbers:
Comments
Yes, I was happy too, history in the making, but that don't give you the right to assemble an a residential area at 2:00 am in the morning and make noise. People have to work and I know that I can't sleep when it's noisey. Peolpe need to remember that your happiness is not everyone elses happiness and you should be respectful. All most people do is make excuses for what they do, instead of saying, "You know maybe if I would not have done, what I did, then this would not had happen." I grew up in Baltimore and mostly all the people here, like to blame everything on the police. We must be accountable for our own actions. Obama had his victory celebration in a large park, that was not a residential area. There were a number place where the group could have gathered, one being the park across from City Hall, it's not residential and considering the cause, I don't think that Mayor Dixon, would have had a problem with that, she probably would have joined the celebration.
Posted by: Babycat | November 9, 2008 1:22 PM
It was ONE night for Pete's sake. ONE night. If you can't put up with one night - that might only happen every hundred years - of people celebrating a historical event...
...you shouldn't be living in the city. I'm confident that if you move out to northern Baltimore County, you won't have to be bothered by such things.
ONE night. Get over it.
Posted by: Baltimore | November 11, 2008 10:02 AM
It doesn't matter where you live -- whether the city, northern Baltimore County, or in the middle of nowhere. No one has the right to disturb the peace. Next time we decide to celebrate something, if you agree and/or are aware of it or not, would you like us to keep you awake in the middle of the night when you have to get up early the next day. You're responsible for your own actions -- act like it. We are a society who seems to always blaming others for our own inability to be responsible. If it's not the cops, it's the neighbors who deserve quiet; if it's not the mortgage companies, it's the real estate agent; and so on and so on. Look up "responsible" in the dictionary!
Posted by: Chris | November 11, 2008 10:24 AM
If someone got hurt or damaged property these same people would by crying where were the police. Anytime there are that many people on the streets celebrating at 2:00 in the morning, many of them probably drinking, anything could happen.
Posted by: MrEd | November 11, 2008 10:41 AM
It does not matter---Crowd control is important; if a person pulls out a gun to shoot in the air to celebrate the occasion , others would scatter, get hurt and possibly killed, police are there to protect folks....Maybe everyone should have been given a personal note to clear the street, get real ! If those who think there was a problem with the police clearing the area in the manner they did, then it is those folks why this country is upside-down....What does one have to do with the other, connect the dots!
Posted by: Ann Myous | November 11, 2008 11:10 AM
Are people really suprised that the cops are being accused of using excessive force? The people who were celebrating Obama's victory are probably the same ones who sue McDonald's when they spill their coffee. The ones who refuse to take off their shoes at an airport security check. The "Chronic Victims."
Now they are upset because they were reprimanded for their own thoughtless actions? I wonder what the responses would be if there was a victory celebration for McCain at 2am? I'm sure the word "racist" would be tossed around. I'm also certain the Obama supporters would've called for the McCain crowd to get tasered, arrested, etc...You can say "Obama made history, and that's why we celebrated..." But face it, if McCain won, it would have been a monumental shock/upset, and his supporters would have had every right to celebrate. And just to be clear, I would expect the police to use the same force to clear the McCain crowd.
Bottom-line: There's a time and place for everything. 2am in a residential area is not the time and place for an impromptu block-party. The cops tried to tell you the same thing, and you got what you deserved for ignoring their orders. If you feel like you were "victimized," GOOD! Maybe next time you'll think twice before you act so ignorant.
Posted by: Charles Brasco | November 11, 2008 11:35 AM
Perhaps some of those arrested will belatedly realize that their rights stop where others' rights begin.
Apparently, all of those arrested were of adult age (chronologically speaking) but were acting like they just had a sugary snack at daycare.
Exuberance is a poor justification for violating the law.
Posted by: ray-ray | November 11, 2008 11:36 AM
while its was a historical and a proud night for african americans people should still understand that others have a job to go to in the morning and they also may be happy but you have to be aware of other people's situation also..
Posted by: TMac | November 11, 2008 12:38 PM
I would guess the ones above who complain about the noise also complain on July 4th when they hear fireworks and if they live near an airport or train tracks they complain about planes and trains, respectively.
Get a life. You don't own this world. It belongs to all of us. When 200 want to celebrate history it's going to happen. Your complaining only makes things worse for you and them.
You now live in a more divided community.
Posted by: michael | November 11, 2008 12:54 PM
michael:
Your post makes no sense. The fireworks that happen on the 4th of July is scheduled well in advance, and is usually over by 9pm. It's expected. Folks that live near an airport or a railroad usually move in with the knowledge that there will be noise. It's expected.
People who take to the streets in a residential neighborhood, celebration or not, and make noise well into the wee hours, can expect to be asked to knock it off, and arrested if they don't. At least, that's what I would expect.
As to being a divided community, I'd say you are correct. There's a clear division between a majority of citizens and a noisy self-indulgent minority.
Posted by: Bob | November 11, 2008 1:21 PM
The person above has there facts wrong, I was at the celebration, there was more like 400-500 people. That amount of people is too many, we actually left right after it started......folks with alcohol in the streets and some people were getting out of hand. Again it was 2 AM people were actually ignoring the police from the start; moral of the story, unless you were there and saw what was going on---you knew something was going to happen----Those arrested were saying they were roughed-around, what a joke---would they have been better off had the police patted them on the a$$ and told them to hit the road----NO, it would have been sexual misconduct-----Celebrate in your own house for now on, I know I will, or someplace that it's "allowed" not a residential area in the city !
Posted by: Anonymous | November 11, 2008 1:47 PM
One moment we make history, the next we are fighting, they celebrated all over the world until the wee hours of he morning,but in Baltimore,MD it is a problem...not by the police....by the people? I agree with containment...to a point ...but if no one is being hurt and no property is damage....your upset because of a couple hours sleep...WOW..Baltimore,Md the world is watching ...shame
Posted by: tori | November 11, 2008 4:10 PM
This comment is to Charles Brasco and the many other people I see comments from in favor of the police. Crowd containment is important for the safety of all, however, your point that you would "expect the police to use the same force to clear the McCain crowd" backfires and is hypocritical for this reason: it never happens. Police brutality isn't just a card that people throw out. Count the number of times where the police have taken over a non-minority crowd by force. Now count the number of times it has happened to minority crowds. The scales tip so far in our favor it's ridiculous. People stated that the police didn't offer badge numbers and did not get on the megaphone, so if you are in the middle of the crowd, how are you to know what's going on. There is a responsibility on both sides of this issue. Yes, the crowd of people should realize and respect the people in the community. But the police have a responsibility to contain a crowd with the least amount of force necessary. Unfortunately, when it comes to crowds of the minority, it seems like force is the only means they know to break us up. Don't all police cars come equipped with loud speakers. Did they use them? Spotlights? Megaphones? Now, on top of that, if they are to protect and serve, but decide to go vigilante and attack a crowd of 200-400 people, all of the people now running to their cars, how many people were unnecessarily hurt in this process. All of the screaming and crying and yelling...now what time is everyone getting to bed? Now how disturbed are the people in the neighborhood?
As a minority person, I don't like it when people pull the race card unnecessarily, however, I also don't like it when non-minorities always side against us in issues like this. Two wrongs don't make a right. In situations when one side is wrong, the "trained" protect&servers are supposed to keep the peace, not cause a riot. I don't expect a "pat on the ass" from the police, but I also don't expect a billy club to the head. Just when you think we've made strides towards change, someone comes along to dash the dream and try to "put us in our place." That time will soon come to an end. There is a change coming and I hope it's soon. And before you come down on any other topic, check the facts on police brutality and police crown control. Read the stories, look at the picture, check out the cases, and tell us we are not justified in our complaints. Sometimes the boy isn't crying wolf. Sometimes the wolf is right there. Unfortunately for us, most of the wolves are people in power (police, judges, principals) and the people in the village look like the wolves, so they just ignore us. It's been going on since we were brought to this country. Isn't it time for change?
Posted by: Ty | November 17, 2008 1:45 PM