Great interview Z! Placing the comment about the hypocracy of the White House's stance against Fox News at the end of the interview was brilliant! Keep up your advocacy for honesty and freedom in journalism.

Well, God Bless America Z & all bloggers. I sure hope the White House is at least on the surface gonna let this go.

I just have one thing to say to Oreilly~ Thanks for having Z on, one of the best choices I have seen in a long time. However, due to some early comments you said about Z on Reality Check I just want to poke fun at you that you are giving yourself too much credit comparing yourself to the Philistines. Now that if funny to me.

Citizens citizens we really are too complacent just accepting way to much & not looking at the bigger picture. If the White House were successful at silencing Fox (which thank gosh I do not see it happening). Who is to say they will not try silencing state govts, local, citizens.

Time to go back to the basics. Something I took away from this is to remember we have different branches of government for a reason, we have a constitution for a reason, we have freedom for a reason.

As clearly evidenced with the ATTEMPT the White House made we should never forget...Freedom is not free. We must work at it, protect it, and call our government out on it when we see the layers of our freedom being pulled away.

Z,

It was a very good interview with you and Mr. O'Reilly. I think this kind of coverage can only help the whole issue. A lot of good points were brought up about how the executive branch should behave in regards to the media and it comes down to really a matter of principle about free press. I hope the WH gets that message.

Mr. David Zurawik (Z), Thanks for going on with Mr. O"Reilly and standing up for the real issue at hand. Not which cable news channel is right or wrong, but how this affects our future as a democracy. And good job Ms. Campbell Brown, also. Maybe this will end the battle.

Thanks for the Goucher shout-out!

Z.. I think your Bill visit was really good.

Its refreshing to see 2 people who usually disagree to be able to have a legitimate conversation regarding an outrageous topic.

Bill pulls no punches and feeds on controversy and I like that he is appreciating the support FOX is getting from the media and public.

Your comment about teaching a class on Media Ethics was perfect. I agree, how could you stand in front of students and not condemn this latest WH folly?

I agree with your statement about the WH and its distractions. Its time that Obama realizes he is the President and he can stop campaigning. Seems his circle did well on the campaign trail, but dont' know what to do in the OFFICE.

Time to WORK! After almost a year in office, I'm scared to think this is the best he is going to offer our country.

Hi MarieE, Thanks so much. I still have to write a story todasy, but I am checking in and out of blog regularly today, and will post as soon as I talk to NBC. I am so happy for the heads-up from our crack crew of bloggers about photos of Morales and Kate. Z

A question of curiosity more than substance: did they initiate this contact for the interview, knowing your position - or - did the Sun contact them in some way?

A good explanation of the issue and, for once, O'Reilly (mostly) allowed someone to finish a thought without serious interruption. I watch FOX and defend it as a news outlet, but O'Reilly''s style is not to my liking. However, the real news guys - not the opinion guys - and their shows are very good in my opinion.

I'm still waiting for one of the "haters" to give serious examples of biased or deceitful reporting by the FOX news people, like Chris Wallace, Shep Smith, Major Garrett, etc. Nice interview Z.

Fox initiated it. Infairness, I have been invited by O'Reilly in the past, and it didn't work out. Thanks. Z

I wonder why Bill Oreilly didn't stick up for MSNBC or NBC when Bush blackballed them.

Gee Z, I didn't really notice where the Fox "battle" was distracting the WH from governing one whit.

Thw WH told the truth and you in the media haven't been able to stop talking about it since. Meanwhile, they just moved on.

Like adults do.

They moved on? The president and three senior administration officials for over two weeks? that is moved on? Yeow. Z

Good job, Z! You hit the nail on the head perfectly. I'm not a Fox News fan, but if the White House is going to claim bias at Fox without claiming it at MSNBC because it runs in their favor there, they need to be called out on their hypocrisy.

MSNBC's promotional ads don't even identify themselves as a "news" organization. They say they are "the place for politics." Some of Z's favorite targets regularly criticize the acministration for its handling of "don't ask don't tell" and its failure to lead on the "public option." So I would not call MSNBC "in the tank" for the current occupant of the White House.

Now I am an ardent avoider of all things from the Murdoch empire. Fox Network shows have always been aimed at the lowest common denominator. I won't watch the Ravens on Fox because those shows used to start with "flag-waving" film clips.

I do, however, agree with those who believe that an attempt to "banish" any news organization is a threat to all news outlets.

Hi, Z. Nice job on O'Reilly's show. I was happy to hear you speak as intelligently as you write!

I personally hate to listen to O'Reilly and the whole Fox News crew. They remind me of an upscale Radar Online, playing fast-and-loose with facts. They spin things in a way that is designed to get the most visceral reactions from their viewers. And it is laughable when O'Reilly declares himself to hate hypocrites, when he is one of the biggest of them all.

Having said all that, I will defend forever the right of Fox News to broadcast their point of view. I may not agree with it; I might be disturbed and maddened by their tactics, but I believe it to be an important right. And when (not if) they do make inflammatory, misleading statements about the administration or its proposals, it is incumbent upon the administration to go about debunking their talk calmly with facts and specifics, instead of using threats of limiting access.

Thanks for listening and for all your great pieces on such a variety of topics.

David: I still think you need to answer the precise argument that the administration is making, namely, that Fox News is a political organization, not a news organization.

The critical question is how to tell the difference between the two. It's not a response to say that the administration should not be making the distinction, because (a) there is a distinction, and (b) every administration must make such distinctions (the writers for AHIP are not reporters and shouldn't get press credentials, etc.).

One possibility for the distinction: a media organization is a political, not a news organzation, when it spends more time facilitating strategic position-taking by one political party than would be warranted by that party's level of public support. This kind of measure would at least get beyond attempts to estimate intention - even though the intention of Roger Ailes is pretty obvious - and would focus on outcomes.

I understand that members of the media will protect the idea of media self-determination. But focusing on that - as you have done here and in your other posts - is only half of the story, since ultimately the media needs to assure the public (I think) that it can serve as something more than a transmission belt for political strategic messages. Fox News is failing at that effort and the rest of the media should be calling it out.

I have consistently written about the failings of Fox, Brett. O'Reilly, Van Susteren and others have fired back, and you can check some of that online easily. I have also gone on record being quoted in other publications, like the "New York Times," criticizing Fox on various journalistic matters. So I have and will continue to deal with that. Thanks. Z

Z -

Great interview! You did a fabulous job of drawing attention to the most disturbing issue here - the ethical compromise that takes place when a person in power attempts to manipulate the media. Regardless of political leanings, when information is withheld and our ability to form our own opinions and judgements is reduced, we all suffer.

I have to say, this makes me wonder what other shannigans the White House is up to and why.

Critics are sticking up for Fox because the Obama administration is engaging in Nixonian tactics; Journalists were being subjected to FBI wiretaps, "black bag" break-ins and IRS audits. There was even a suggestion of murdering columnist Jack Anderson.

Wait, what?

Oh, right. FOX was openly criticized. Never mind.

Z.,

Really enjoyed your short, yet seemingly fruitful tete-a-tete w/ 'Billo' yesterday. I had no idea you would be on, and rarely watch "The Factor", but I happened to serendipitously stumble on your interview while channel surfing. Unfortunate freeze-frame on your blog YouTube video attachment of your discussion. It looks like you dozed off in mid-conversation. HA!

I appreciated the fact that you didn't let ofttimes bully, O'Reilly, get away w/ that "all the rest of those pinheads"-remark, referring scornfully to most of his left-wing media critics who have been on his case for years, labeling him a "Philistine", and a loathsome creature akin to Satan himself.

Kudos Z., that you are teaching "media" at the college level.(Where do you find the time?) Your comment that you could not face your students knowing in your heart that you were not being true to your core values and beliefs, essentially being two-faced, or hypocritical w/ them (or words to that effect), was a very powerful statement, and refreshing to hear in these troubled and difficult times, when desperate people may resort to desperate means.

Sadly, there are countless examples of celebrated, high-profile cases of individuals in sports, entertainment, business and politics losing their moral compass, and in so doing, harming themselves, relatives, and others thru their immoral, illegal, or deceitful actions; Mr. Bernard Madoff comes immediately to mind. It's heartening to know that at least there are some folk, like yourself Z., who choose the higher ground, and take full responsibility for their beliefs and actions. (Of course, as imperfect (human) beings, we sometimes lose our ethical bearings, and stumble.)

Interestingly, the Josephson Institute of Ethics, based here in L.A., has just released an extensive survey on age-related attitudes toward lying as a means to personal success, and their researchers found that teens 17 years of age and younger are 5 times more likely than those older than 50 to believe that lying and cheating are necessary to succeed. (51%for teens, 10% for elders). One of the key directors of the study opined, "Just think, if five times the number of people in business, politics and banking hold those beliefs. That's alarming."

Sorry for going off on that ethics tangent, Z. .

I also liked your little shared chuckle after O'Reilly asked if the press has a certain "hidden sense of nobility." Nice to see those little asides of humor, even when discussing such a 'heavy' topic.

Hopefully going forward, you two guys can continue your civil, respectful dialogue on this critical and fundamental issue of our right to free speech, the freedom of the press, and just how much suasion, or censure 'the powers that be'. i.e., big government, should wield in the arena of public (or private) discourse.

So far you've made us "Z on T.V." bloggers all proud, David Z.. Nothing amiss w/ your moral compass.

ALEX

Paul _D -

Critics are sticking up for FOX because : Anita Dunn said that FOX is not a legitimate news channel. FOX news was left out of an interview with the pay czar when several other news channels were invited. Ms. Jarrett said that FOX was biased, but did not mention MSNBC. How many more examples do we need of the executive branch overstepping its boundaries onto freedom of press. I am glad someone is watching.

Ok bloggers time for joke of the day:

Did you see the breaking news on MSNBC @ lunch bloggers?

Apparently the White House released a press release saying there will not be a Nativity Scene on the front lawn of the White House this Christmas...Seems as though they couldn't find 3 Wise Men on Capitol Hill.~ courtesy of my niece who posted it on my Facebook.

Okay, I am walking out of the office with a smile on my face. Thanks, Irene. Z

Z, Loved the interview. Great job stating your position, and there's not much more that I can add to it.

Z, i wrote my rebuttal to your anti-last season Wire on yout 15 favorite shows blog. sorry
i didnt know what place.
Richard

Great to see you Z. You are like Fox-- Fair and Balanced. Thats all I want. I can decide from there.

I think John Stewart got it right last night in his opening. It was called For Fox Sake! You should watch it.

http://www.thedailyshow.com/

here is the point: the FOX Commentary feeds FOX News rather than the other was around.

when FOX Newscasters say "some people say" or "people are saying" the "people" that they are talking about are their own FOX Pundits.

its make-believe news and i think they should be called out.

long over due.

Hi Z,

Great interview with Bill O'Reilly, and I don't like Bill O'Reilly at all. I was watching Jon Stewart last night, as I do every night he is on and the first 15 minutes were dedicated to this situation. It was absolutely hysterical, and he made some great points, he also included the interview with Valerie Jarret at the end and mocked her in not stating the same thing about MSNBC. When you get the opportunity please watch last night's Jon Stewart about this whole situation of news vs. opinion. I would like to go back to the time of when the Bush Administration did the same thing to MSNBC and for some reason it wasn't as big of an issue. I beg all "news" organizations to report fact without opinion and allow the pundits to give opinion for those that choose to agree or disagree. My in-laws watch Fox News constantly and may I just say that some of the things that they say absolutely blow my mind, I have long given up in correcting their "facts" but the reality is they get their information from Fox News, and it's not always the most accurate information. MSNBC is no different as to how they "spin" their opinion, ask GW and Cheney. I am just fed up with all of these cable "news" networks, I beg of each of them to be a "news" channel again and report the facts and allow us to make our own opinions as I don't really care what the " news reporter" opinion is. Z I agree with you that the White House should give up this dumb battle and look at it as a non-issue and allow them to say what they want. Let's allow the people to make their own judgement of what is fact or what is fiction, isn't that the beauty of this country we are allowed to make our own decisions.

Z,

Heard you on Rodricks' show and now you're following this on your site, so its still hot for you. I can appreciate you not caring for bias one way or the other as you briefly explained on Rodricks, I just don't understand why you don't see the issue for what it actually is.

The White House claims bias by a major cable news network and says they'll treat them as such knowing they'll be literally walking into the lion's den when they work with them. What is so difficult to understand?

A poll released by Pew last evening reinforces that stance as it shows Americans also view FoxNews has the most ideologically biased news programming of all the television news outlets. MSNBC was viewed as having high bias by Americans as well, but not nearly as much as FoxNews was. So Americans agree with the White House.

Andrew Sullivan, a staunch Conservative who agrees with the president on many issues and promoted him during the election last year and yet disagrees on some issues as well or how policy is carried out, points toward a poll from the FoxNews website that asks the question, "Do you think the Taliban wants victory more than Obama?" The blog which brought this poll question to light could not find a similar question asked in a FoxNews poll over the past 8 years. I've seen other similar poll questions pointed out by others in the past.

So FoxNews is the issue here. They hold an ideological bias in their coverage. No, they aren't completely biased all the time, but they are biased. Yes, MSNBC has politically biased shows as well, but they aren't the issue here. FoxNews is the issue and they pursue politically biased attack journalism with a fervor not seen on any other cable news channel. Okay, with the exception of the Comedy Central channel, I'll grant you that.

So what is wrong with the White House's stance that FoxNews holds a bias against their views and policies and will do business with that fact in mind?

Hi Mike, The White House wants to ostracize Fox for ideological bias, but not MSNBC which suffers the same bias in the other direction. That's one issue. the larger one, though, is this: The executive branch of government does not tell the press how to behave. That is not the way democracy works. One of the primaary functions of the press is to be watchdog on the exdcutive branch. If the press allows itself to be bullied by the executive branch, democracy is in big trouble. Thanks for your thoughtful analysis and questions. Z

Can you please provide comment on the LA Times piece which I have linked?

Of interested is the portion regarding Brett Baier and the "All Star Panel".

Hi, happy to link to Times, but I cannot find the link. Can you re-send? Thanks. Z

Great job Z! I don't always agree with you or Bill O'Reilly but I know honesty and integrity when I see it. Thanks for keeping real.

Z., seems like you tweaked your Youtube video clip a tad. This time the initial freeze-frame has your eyes definitely open, even though you look like you've been overworked and underpaid......a bit bleary-eyed. HA! (I'm just pulling your leg a bit. These 'suspended' video images are rarely flattering, and usually look more like an ersatz Francis Bacon portrait.)

My friend Ruth, back in the little town of Nacogdoches, East TX, home of Stephen F. Austin University, e-mailed me a cute quasi-political joke last evening that I thought i would share w/ you and our fellow bloggers. Goes like this: "They're not going to have the annual Xmas nativity scene creche on the White House lawn this year.... They couldn't seem to find three 'wise men' in all of Washington." (Groan)

Remember folks, fall back on Sunday morning. Enjoy that extra hour of shut eye.
Have a super, ghoulish, and safe Halloween, yawl.

ALEX

Yes, someone sent me a clip with a better freeze frame. You caught it. But I am definitely overworked and underpaid -- no doubt about that. Maybe I need to go to a spa or another vacation spot like Kate. Thanks, ALEX. Z

Sunday's right around the corner. I wonder wonder what will be on the Sunday morning White House agenda?

Nice to hear from you Alex M. Make sure you join us in all things Gosselin.

I hope it is not more war talk on Fox. I hope that settles down. i'm tired of being in the trenches on that one. It's been three weeks. Z

Z,

You probably really do need a vacation. I know I do, from Jon and Kate. I'm sure you are overworked by the time you are done with us. I am sure all of the bloggers appreciate it though. Thanks for answering O'Reilly's call. And keeping us caught up with all of the articles and TV culture.

Irene and Z,

I agree two things that we can't seem to move past Jon and Kate Gosselin and the issues of the war. I can't tell where we are going with that either. Send more troops, don't send more troops. Another thing the administration seems to come to terms with.

ALEX M., I agree always good to see you.
We'll see, Sunday is another day.

Irene,

Thanks for the earlier acknowledgment. It feels nice to be missed. Actually, I think when I kinda 'exercised my franchise', so to speak, a while back, tossing in my guesstimate on how many millions of folk would be tuning into that Monday, Oct. 27th, Kate G. TLC "special"(at your urging), I pretty much threw in the towel on this American travesty/ tragedy. (Did Z. ever come up w/ a final official tally on that one.?)

I'm virtually at a loss for words (can you believe THAT?), as I feel all you super-eloquent, witty, engaged bloggers on "Z on T.V." have pretty much sliced, diced, pureed, and chopped this topic 'every-which-way-but-loose'. You guys, and tenacious blogmeister, Z., are just great, and I've gotten such a kick out of following your vigilant 'Kate watch' comments over the past week, or so, where it seems, at times, like the only game in town, w/ some Obama Administration versus FOXNews stuff thrown in for a little comic relief.

I believe all you guys, w/ your excellent contributions, and sincere, yet ofttimes, cynical inputs (how could we not be, just a little), gave credence to Z.'s earlier defense of the "Jon & Kate plus 8" show (and the tremendous media/ blogosphere buzz it created), as a valuable sociological phenomenon, worthy of serious intellectual study and scholarship. I was originally a bit of a doubter in this regard, but I think I've come around to Z.'s camp.

Z.'s recent listing of his top 15 "T.V. landscape-changing" network prime-time shows from the '50s thru the '70s was a nice change of pace. It was fun to clear some of our mental cobwebs and wax a little nostalgic on what was definitely a more innocent, yet amazingly fertile period in television history. It was fun looking back in the rear-view mirror. Looking forward to Z.'s second list.

Don't worry, Irene, I haven't gone into seclusion, joined some crazed cult, or hooked up w/ some other blog. For me this is the best, most thoughtful and stimulating blog out there, bar none. I think I'm just suffering from reality T.V. burnout; well I'll be honest, just 'Kate minus Jon+ 8' burnout.

Hope you and yours have a fun, and safe Halloween, tonight.

ALEX

Yikes, I forgot. Lats week was such a struggle, I lost track of ourt contest. I have to go back and see who had 3 million. I will get on it. Z

What always fascinates me is how the people in the media can't admit why Fox News is successful. It's the only Right Wing network on the air. They cornered the market. If you want to watch left wing spin the world is your oyster, you've got MSNBC,CNN,CNBC,CBS news,NBC news and ABC news. They all tilt left and they all give the Obama spin. It continues to amaze why no other networks say "Hey let's take Fox on" Hire some of their talent and skew to the right. Until one does Fox will continue to dominate.

Z.,

You are totally forgiven for losing track of the Kate G. contest winner(s?). So 3 million was the rounded-off tally? That means I was a mere 499,999 off, since i deducted my non-watching-self from my grand total guesstimate of 3.5 million. Indeed, it must have been a wacky, hectic, week for you w/ the O'Reilly interview, and other sundry demands. Rumor has it you came THAT close to a cranial explosion! WOW! Maybe you do need a helmet?

Oh, by the by, I'm still holding my breath on the name of that guy mugging in the pic w/ Neil Simon on your earlier "Show of Shows" post on your top 15 T.V. prime-time 'landscape-shapers'. Since you are the author of the tome "Jews of Prime Time", I figured (dah), of all the folks on the planet, you would surely know the answer. ( I know, don't call me Shirley. HA!). And is comedy writer Doc Simon a blood relative of Neil Simon? Maybe some of our savvy bloggers might have a clue?

Z., let's hope this coming week gives you some well earned, and deserved relief. We don't want you coming down w/ 'Harried Critic's Syndrome'. And you thought H1/N1 was bad news. HA!

And Sherry T., Sunday is, indeed, "another day". (With one more glorious hour of sleep. Oh joy!)

HI ALEX, Thanks for the forgiveness. The rumors of cranial explosion are totally true. The guy in the picture is Danny Simon, Neil's brother. They were both writers on the show. I should have said that. I am soon coming out with 15 best all-time cale TV series. But not this weekend. Thanks. I am HCS and beyond, and there is no shot for it. Ha. Z

Z,

Can't wait for the 15 best all time cable TV series. All these lists are fun!

Hey thanks ALEX. We all miss you, drop by more often. And thanks for the *fall back time reminder*, I just set my mom's clocks back. She doesn't know how, she is 83.

Have a nice evening everyone. Is this related to the post. Z is too nice to complain.

Z.,

Woe is me!

Don't tell me you have "Harried Critic Syndrome-Type B", better known as "HCS/ T-B Extremis"? You're right, "there is no shot" for that sucker. What a total bummer.

I might suggest downing several large glasses of that POM (pomegranate) juice (I know it's over-priced), doubling up on your Centrum/ Silver tabs, ingesting mega-doses of raw bee pollen, while adding minced tongue of newt (not Gindgrich HA!) and canceling your subscription to The New Yorker. It's the Witches of Eastwick quickie-cure, and appears to work wonders during the week of All-Hallow's-Eve. (How convenient, no?) Actually, that newt tongue could be a problem. Trader Joe's and Whole Foods never seem to carry them. (Too exotic for their tastes, I guess.) Oh, heck Z., just take a couple of chewable kids aspirins (preferably orange flavored) and DON'T cancel your New Yorker subscription. You should be fine by mid-week.

Z., thanks for the Simon brothers clarification. I new you'd pull thru in the clutch. I can finally breath. now. HA! I gather Danny didn't have the later mega-success of brother Neil?

Looking forward to your list of "15 best of all-time cable T.V. series". That should be a fun one, as well. I'm going to take the liberty of priming the pump w/ one of my Cable favs, namely "South Park", the precursor to later irreverent cartoon shows that pushed the envelop of satire, celebrity parody and good taste.(Family Guy, et al) Actually, the hilarious, "REN and STIMPY", the creation of crazed Canuck-transplant cartoonist John Krisfiluci (may have mangled his last name) pre-dated "South Park", and likely informed much of the kind of adolescent, sophomoric, "gross" humor that has become a hallmark of South Park.

Cartman rules!

Happy Halloween everyone!

ALEX

I like the cocktail you suggest, except for the tongue of Newt. Although since I dared to have on on-air conversation with someone who is a very important figure on the beat I cover, Bill O'Reilly, I think there are a few folks out there now who think I have been consuming the tongue of Newt. Thanks. Z