For me it's quite simple, when they make you feel small and seem too good for your money. Just after Louisiana opened some friends and I went there for a late lunch. Granted we were in college and not formally attired, but we weren't slobs and we had money. The hostess went and asked the manager if they could seat us (in a largely empty restaurant), then placed us upstairs out of the way. Needless to say, I have not been back.

I believe any restaurant where the owner/chef is referred to as "chef" (and they seem appalled when you refer to him/her by his/her real name) is pretentious.

I would agree that pretentious is making people feel not good enough and making promises you can't keep. It isn't being formal, although some formal places are very good at pretentious, too.

In Baltimore, I haven't been to a place I found completely pretentious, although I've seen danger signs in Pazo and Bicycle. Gertrude's, too.

I was in a BBQ joint once where the counter person insisted on giving me every ingredient in every sauce they offered. That is pretentious. If your sauces are all that unusual, how about just giving me a small taste?

The anti-pretentious ur-restaurant, for me, is Isabella's, especially when Dan is there. The food is much better than you'd think, it is friendly, cozy and just warm.

Although it will often correlate with the actual quality of the food that isn't a prerequisite.

personable ----> precious ---> pretentious ---> closed

Birches

Matt Hudock - I couldn't agree with you more on Louisiana. After 2 hours and only having a soup course delivered, we pulled the ripcord and were laughed at by the host when she asked us how our meal was and a very objective, clinical summary of what took place was delivered. She then dropped our coats on the ground before handing them to us - nice touch.

I think 'pretentious' is when a restaurant thinks they are so good that the area needs them more than they need the area and it shows. They think they can get away giving your dining experience a salty, dry rub and slow roast you without ruining their chances of a return visit.

Having the servers take a sip of your wine before poring at Cinghiale is a little pretentious, I think.

Sorry, I meant 'pouring'.

Birches? Really? How is a place that has two servers and with a chef who occasionay does double duty, chef/server, pretentious?

Because they have house rules?

Because service is slow?

Charleston is pretentious, but it's supposed to be.

Ixia was pretentious, but it was supposed to be.

I refer to my workplace chef as "Chef". It's not his fault he works for "the man" (Aramark). He still has the hat and deserves the respect of the title. I don't think that it's any different than referring to an M.D. as "Doctor" even if they happen to work for a walk in clinic.

I have no problem calling a M.D. a doctor; however, I will not extend that moniker to those with PhDs from ersatz disciplines, such as sociology, education or anything that ends with the word "studies".

I guess that statement probably makes me pretentious. Well, you'll have that.

The Sun's style agrees with you, only MDs get called doctor, although I don't think anyone would dare say the disciplines that don't get the title are ersatz. My father, a professor, used to say that at colleges where everyone has a Ph.D., no one is referred to as "doctor." It's just the places where some do and some don't. EL

Brewer's Art once refused to seat me in their dining room because I was a single diner. The hostess told me--blatantly, to my face--that I wouldn't order enough off the menu to justify a table. It was early in the evening, the dining room had just opened and no one else was seated there. Pretentious or just rude?

RoCK, I work in the medical field. Do you really think I'd disagree with you on that? Puhleese!

Does that make me also pretentious? Perhaps....

I generally have no problem using whatever title someone prefers.

I still get annoyed, though, about this one thing: when there is a list of people, typically in a photo caption, on the "society/party" page, and it reads:

Carlos de Sevilla; Edith W. Superaugh; William J. Slatterer, Philip Robillard, Frieda Hoehn, Dr. Joseph J. Gennari, Francis Karnegis

Either we're using titles or we're not, and if we're not, then the doctor doesn't get one either. Or, am I wrong?

When the executive chef comes out to say hello to me and my party during a meal, I usually greet them as Chef. But I'm embarrassed to say it's because usually I have forgotten their name more than any other reason.

Ouch! RoCK, I think I take a little offense to that. Someone with ten years of education post High School, numerous cited publications and research to back it all up certainly has earned the title 'doctor' with their Ph.D. Certainly, the title of 'chef' is conferred far more loosely. At least with a Ph.D. you are certain there is an abundance of formal education behind that title.
Now, the accreditation of the granting institution is a whole 'nother matter.

Not saying that chefs need to be formally trained. On the contrary... However, that Ph.D. certainly deserves the respect that they have earned. Whether or not you find value in their field of study is irrelevant.

I find that the following often correlate with a pretentious establishment:

1. No dollar signs on the menu.

2. Indeed, listing of every ingredient unnecessarily - I really don't care if my hamburger is in fact an organic black angus burger with aioli soaked portabello, freshly prepared white vermont cheddar and thinly sliced heirloom tomatoes with butterhead lettuce on foccacia - no doubt I'm literally paying an extra dollar per word on the menu.

3. When the menu expressly states that service will be slow because "the food is so good and it takes time to prepare yadda yadda" - honestly if the food is good enough its reputation will precede itself, and everyone knows that.

My worst experience was at a Starbucks! Years before they got into the Frappacino craze, they refused to sell me an iced coffee, because "it would ruin the integrity of the coffee"[YES, he really said that!]. So I said (in my best Jack Nicholson voice): "Then give me a black coffee, medium (not venti, grandee, or whatever!) and please may I have a cup of ice" the guy told me I would have to pour the coffee over the ice on my own, that he would not be permitted to do it for me. To this day, I refuse to order anything with made-up faux Italian name. Just give me the middle size, whatever you want to call it, and make it coffee. Just coffee.

Joyce: When someone else calls that person "Chef" it is their choice (regardless of the qualifications or experience).

When the person who hired the guy doing the cooking (even with qualifications & experience) insists on the staff and customers using the term it is pretentious.

When the guy doing the cooking (even with qualifications & experience) insists they be called "Chef" it is comical.

I dislike it when menus describe kitchen processes as done by hand, as
in salads containing lettuce that is "hand-torn". I think that's
pretentious.

I think a lot of pretension is in the eye of the beholder, and that
"pretentious" can be a stand-in for "intimidating". I think it's often
easier to say that the restaurant was pretentious than to say "I felt
intimidated because I don't know what romescu is and was afraid to ask."
I do believe that no one can make you feel inferior without your
permission.

What about a maestro?

http://tinyurl.com/njfbmf

In Portuguese!

And look, a restaurant scene at the end of the clip! Relevance!

Well I am going to open a place in downtown called “Minimum”, Here’s a what our menu will look like.

Stuff to get before your big meal

A piece of chicken with some sauce on it

Some crab with a vegetable

Crab soup

Mussels with sauce and vegetables and stuff

Big meal plates

A piece of fish with some sauce on it and potato stuff

A crabcake with coleslaw

Some ground beef with a roll and some vegtables
Add cheese its costs more

Dessert

Ice Cream with chocolate sauce

Seriously, where do you draw the line between pretentious and not being boring. Sure some places can make you feel small, but it doesn’t mean you have to care or actually FEEL small. If I am going to spend money on a meal I want them to convey that they actually know what they are doing in the kitchen, and that the servers actually care about what they are serving. Sometimes they go to far, OK, but I like it when they explain things.

Hello, sean.

"Hello, Laura Lee."
Pretentious haiku writer
Sean returns to blog.

"Reduction" makes my pretentiousness detector go berserk. The word is "sauce". Get over yourself.

Also, calling any kind of flavored mayo "aioli". If it doesn't have garlic in it, it's NOT aioli.

It is my belief -
Restaurant pretension can
Cause hypertension

Waiter sips your wine
No prices on the menu
This place costs too much

Another thread waits
for thy best pretensions, sean.
Take a stab at it.

EL writes to split
Hits grow with controversy
Paid by the traffic

If only. :-) EL

But a reduction is not the same as a sauce.

As someone who enjoys cooking at home, I enjoy reading a description of exactly what I'm going to be eating. I think that those who truly enjoy food like knowing what's in there.

The post from JimmyJamesInc. cracked me up.

That being said, I can think of a perfect example of pretension: Pazo's no flip-flop rule. If it's summer, I'm usually wearing my Cole Haan flip flops. They are attractive and stylish, but that's unacceptable. Next time I'll wear my Walmart "Keds". Should I be wearing closed toed shoes in the summer with socks?

I agree with Evan about the "oh the food is so special and it takes all this time to make so don't even think of complaining about anything". If I am paying $15 + for an entree it better be good.

And NO. Some person who has a Phd in "Womens Studies" or something like that doesn't serve to be called "Doctor".

when the service doesn't live up to the food or the prices. At the Prime Rib, some might say that the jacket requiremetn is pretentious, but the servers are polite, unfailingly willing to give you any explanation or additional time, and no one makes you wonder if you aren't good enough. similar at charleston. not so at Pazo or Louisiana

I think it's pretentious when they make you pay at the first window, and then drive up to the second window to pick up.

make it stop

My dad had a PhD in chemistry and was a college professor, and was always "Dr. A-", which didn't seem inapprpriate but rather respectful, as Maggi noted above.

If a PhD anthropologist prefers to be addressed with their customary honorific, what's the harm in doing so? Or maybe the better question is, what would be the advantage or upside to refusing to do so?

I'm not religious but I address pastors by their preferred honorific, I'm not in the military but when conversing with a customer that is, I address them as Colonel Whatever, not as Bob.

Addressing a PhD as "Doctor" is a long-established custom, just as addressing any grown man as Mister is, and is the polite thing to do unless the person addressed says "no, call me by my first name"

"I do believe that no one can make you feel inferior without your
permission."

I think Skewed Tomato hit the nail on the head.

RayRay is the man! That was a good one.

I think places that insist on lighting a candle before you can eat their cheese should be on the list.

New knowledge is gained:
"Haiku can cause a headache."
Sean is a sadist.

Pazo's "seasonal dress code."

It's summer. Get over yourselves.

[sic]

I fail to see the difference between this and a Pd.D. in say...History.

Hey Brewer's Hill Resident, I had a similar experience at Brewer's Art. My friends and I used to stop in for drinks before/after a performance at Andie Musik. Recently, we stopped in there before a performance by Ana Vidovic. There were no seats available in the bar, so, we decided to get a table. The hostess said she couldn't seat us because we didn't have a reservation and since Jerry Seinfeld was performing at the Meyerhoff that night, the tables had to be kept open for the "theater" crowd. That is pretentious. We were there around 4:30/5:00 p.m. and the dining room was EMPTY. I asked the hostess if all the tables would be filled in the next 1/2 hour to an hour. She ignored me and walked away. We haven't gone back there since.

Woops! That posted well...

I meant to say that I fail to see how a Ph.D. in Women's Studies is different than a Ph.D. in history. The former is a subset of the latter.

halstevens,
Cat's Eye Pub?

My boyfriend and I are fairly new to Canton. We walked into the Gin Mill figuring we would try some new food but nothing too fancy since it was next to places like Bartenders, Kislings, Castaways, etc. We sat down and realized it was Restaurant Week which meant the deal was a three-course meal for $75. We weren't prepared to spend that so we decided to tell the host we weren't aware and had to leave before ordering drinks. A man I assume owns the place or at the very least manages it, came up and asked why why we were leaving. It was akward of him to ask but we told him we didn't know it was restaurant week and we were thinking something more along the lines of a burger. The guy turned to us, laughed, and said "I couldn't possibly ask my chef to make something like a burger!" He said it so loud the whole place turned to look at us. Is it that weird to want a burger in Canton? Maybe you had to be there but restaurant week or not, something about this place just screams snooty.

Maggi, I been studying wimmen for a purty long time, but my history's terrible.

I went to Da Mimmo's once a bunch of years ago. I stopped in on a Saturday afternoon. They were open. I was the only customer in the place, as far as I remember.

There was a bartender on duty and the kitchen was open. I sat at the bar. I asked if I could see the menu. I looked it over and asked if I could order an appetizer. The bartender said No, you will have to sit at a table in the (empty) dining room. Yeah, but I just want a bite with a glass of wine. Oh no, you can't order a glass of wine in the dining room, only a bottle. Well, I only want a glass. Then you have to stay at the bar. But I can't eat at the bar? No.

Okay.

So I order a glass of chianti. He pulls out an airline bottle and twists off the metal cap. I said, you're an expensive Italian restaurant and you're serving that? Well, yes, that way it's fresh. Uh, sure.

That's what I would call hoity polloi, a mix of low class, pretention and bad business. I've only been there once but I've told that story 30 times.

sean, I need to take a little break from haiku so I can practice speaking in complete sentences. You carry on, and don't be deterred by haiku headache, who is probably just jealous of your mad skilz and is afraid to try for fear of being left down at the bottom of a cwm.

RayRay, I hear it's a good place to get cheese on a Friday.

No, the dead horse I've been beating is starting to smell a bit. Probably time to let it go...

Although I am intrigued by the idea of only speaking in haiku for a day or so. Of course, I'm at least as intrigued by NOT being sued for divorce or fired, so we'll see which wins out.

Waiters who carry around devices that appear the shape and size of an elephant tusk and condescendingly ask if you'd like ground pepper. Why can't they just put it in a small shaker and place it on the table so that you can pour it (if you'd like) without making a scene?

Ditto the Starbucks comment-small, medium, large and "I just worked 24 hours straight and I'm tired as shi* size" should be the names of coffee sizes.

it was Restaurant Week which meant the deal was a three-course meal for $75

That's a weird story Alicia. Restaurant Week three course meals are $30 for dinner, $20 for lunch.

The Gin Mill? Is that even a restaurant? I thought it was a bar with food. I can't imagine being able to order $75 worth of food there.

I just looked at their menu. You could not have been in the Gin Mill. Example: “Tex Mex Tuesday's” Choice of Chicken, Beef and Fish Taco's $1.75.

Gin Mill Burger - 9oz. burger w/ bacon, lettuce, tomato, sautéed onions melted cheddar & chipotle mayo on a kaiser roll $8

The deal with restaurant week is that you get a bargain. Now if I order the most expensive appetizer, entree and dessert at the GM it would cost 10+23+6=39.

Sorry Alicia, none of the details of your comment match reality.

Good job, sean. Have a
bottle of Clos la Coutale.
Taste the victory.

Matt Hudock hit the nail on the head, there is no reason for a guest who is spending money to be treated like they do not belong or that their money is somehow not good enough.

My husband and I met my family at Regi's (hardly the calibur of some establishments already included in this list) for a late lunch/early dinner a few months ago and the hostess was incredibly boorish. She waved the menus around and huffed and puffed that she would have to see what she could do...I should mention that the resturant was empty. We left without being seated. We haven't been back since nor do we ever plan on it.

There once were some posts from the fog,
which the readers stuffed into a bog.
No more haiku! they screamed,
and they aren't even clean!
And your poetry is naught but a dog!

(I actually would like to hear Laura Lee telling her kids to clean their rooms in haiku.)

halstevens,
Yes, but not until the "Cheese Friday Candle" is lit.

Bunch of whiners here.

WAAA Why can't I use a pepper shaker with tasteless pepper?

WAAA Aioli has garlic in it idiots, im such a culinary expert!

WAAA why can't I wear my flip flops to dinner?

WAAA there are no dollar signs on the menu, I dont know what the numbers mean without them!

Some of you are being completely absurd. EL knew this would happen, she is laughing maniacly right now, like Mr. Burns, as she watches the hit meter keep ticking.

It's like open mic night at the crummy comedy club with all the batsht crazys trying their hand at observational humor.

and they aren't even clean!

That gives me an idea... so:

Here's my first dirty haiku!

(Edited for the Sun site)

B**t** **g* **j*
W*** *as*** gr***g ***
**e* **u*ho* d***

I call BS on Alicia. The Anti Shill. One of the other places she listed is "hers". Who knows which one.

That's my theory, and I'm stickin to it.

Anonymous posts
Make no lasting impression
Like teardrops in rain

Anyone that is not medical doctor that uses the "Dr" as a title is pretentious. Unless, you can perform a life saving medical procedure you ain't got no business using Dr. All you are is a restaurant Dr.

My name is Detective John Kimble.

sean, I think I can pronounce that dirty one in Klingon.

The Gin Mill screams snooty? It's a place where you are not allowed to wear your baseball cap backwards. I propose that any place that has rule regarding how people wear their baseball caps indoors is shooting for a higher class meathead crowd, but still the effluvia that washed down from Towson. If I were to go there I would expect to see all the brohams downing their Jaeger bombs with pinkies extended.

Hu'tegh!

Brewer's Hill Resident, could you drop me a line at volker @ thebrewersart dot com? What you describe goes completely contrary to our policy and I would like to rectify the situation.
Thanks,
Volker
Brewer's Art

chris, firstly, the dining room at the Brewer's Art does not open until 5:30, and secondly, on those Seinfeld nights every table was needed at 5:30 to satisfy reservations. Something worth remembering in restaurants that accept resevervations: just because someone is not sitting at a table when you are looking at it does not mean that the table is available! Keeping tables for people who have made reservations well in advance on a show night is not pretentious, it is good customer service. Sorry if you felt slighted.

Volker
Brewer's Art

There is a hierarchy of Doctors:

One Jewish Mother to another: "My daughter is engaged to a Doctor."

Second Jewish Mother: "Is he a Doctor, a Doctor, or a Doctor, a Dentist?"

Volker,

Ever think about serving lunch? My wife and go out for lunch almost every Saturday and Sunday and frequently drive to Appalachian Brewing and Victory since Red Brick has almost zero hops in their IPA, Ellicott City has food bordering on bad, Capital Brewing closed at the Inner Harbor, and Duclaw is mediocre at best. I can guarantee you we would eat lunch at your place atleast once a month.

Volker, sorry I didn't describe the whole situation in detail (unlike some menus that have been discussed here). We must have been there after 5:30 because there were people at one or two tables. Perhaps I shouldn't have said empty. I should have said 98% empty. I understand the reservation thing, but, we were told by the hostess she couldn't seat us because the tables had to be kept open. She never used the word "reserved". That is why I asked if they were going to be filled in the next half hour, which she ignored my question and walked away. For a 7 o'clock show, there was not many people, except in the bar area. Your establishment is pretentious and the hostess was VERY RUDE.

My vote for most pretentious restaraunt in Bmore goes to Pazo, mainly for their waitstaff who act offended that I don't always order a drink. If I'm in the mood for wine, I'll order wine - but there are many times when all I want is a glass of water, so don't give me attitude for it!

I have to admit Volker...the last few times I have been to Brewer's the hostess was too cool for school for my tastes.

I would argue that anyone who refuses to call people who worked hard in graduate school for many years and did a long work of original research "Doctor" is pretentious. The degree is "Doctor of Philosophy" and in many disciplines (yes, even the "ersatz" ones) it takes years longer to achieve than an MD.

I would also argue that people with any kind of degree who insist on being called "Doctor" are pretentious.

But, having earned two masters and a Ph.D. in 10 years, I sure think it's nice when people choose to say it. And I think it's lovely that a medical specialist I see regularly - who holds a named professorship and is a program director at Johns Hopkins Hospital and has an international reputation - makes a careful point of calling me "Dr." when I see him. Decidedly not pretentious.

But what do I know? I just studied British literature.

Volker, I forgot to mention that wouldn't it have been good customer service to try to accommodate people who were there at that moment ready, willing and able to spend money, specially since the bar area was so overcrowded (which our original intention was to order food and drinks in the bar)? A simple attempt to review the reservation log to verify that indeed the dining room was booked solid through the evening and that we could not be "squeezed in" would have been enough. Her failure,or refusal, to attempt to be accommodating is what makes Brewer's Art pretentious.

I'm with you Dr. Kristin. You need to do original thinking, research and writing to get a PhD. No such things are required to graduate from medical school. Plus medical doctors demand that you call them physicians. Talk about misplaced pretention.

Professor is a much higher title than Doctor in my book. So, when folks with PhDs want to be called "Doctor," I wonder why they want to be mistaken for an MD and why they want the lesser title.

I was raised to call people what they want to be called. Doesn't mean I don't laugh later.

I have been a chef for 15 + years. I have "staged" in euroupe, worked my ass of for 14+ hours a day, graduated from a top in culinary school, peeled potatos until my hands cramped, all the while enduring my share of bullshit- I have earned my title as executive pastry chef. Please feel free to use it.

Chefs make me happy, professors of women's studies do not.

I would love to further explore this point; however, I need to go cook my wife dinner.

Do I have to call you Executive Pastry Chef or is Chef Kitty sufficient? Meow.

In general I think all titles are ... wait for it ... wait for it ... un-American. It looks really lame when the guy who played Gandhi demands that Kelly Ripa call him Sir Ben Kingsley. Or the guy who sang "Benny and the Jets" has to be called Sir Elton John when that's not even his real name. Too bad Meat Loaf isn't English because Sir Meat Loaf has such a sweet ring to it.

P.S. Kitty, anyone who can make delicious desserts, well, I will call you anything you want. Meow indeed. I'm getting dizzy just thinking of a woman who can bake. I haven't had a decent piece of cake in a million years. The quality of desserts in general is lame. I guess I'm not going to the right places.

All hail Executive Dessert Goddess Kitty. That's way better than Dr.

Ooooo, Mr. Meat, you are such a commoner.

I find Da mimmo's silly pictures of lame celebrities all over the walls pretty embarrassing and gives me a chuckle because of how proudly they are displayed yet the problem is they really make me want to eat somewhere else like I should have done in the first place.

Certainly agree with those who find Starbucks pretentious. Just give me a cuppa coffee for chrissakes!

I guess that when poor service happens, and it does happen infrequently, my response is to find someone with more authority to solve the problem. People have bad hair days and they shouldn't be working in the service industry. Businesses are interested in maintaining patrons in a difficult and highly competitive environment and are quite willing to solve problems such as these.

Hey Marmalade, what are you up to this weekend?

I vote for RayRay's comment on this post as Comment of the Week.

As for all the posters arguing about who and who should not be called "Dr", I'm sorry to see D@L becoming so fractious.

I'm sorry to see D@L becoming so fractious.

Oooo, I could not agree more. Most unseemly indeed. I believe that unity of purpose has an almost erotic appeal. Consider for example my most favored animation cartoon The Gopher Gophers in Gopher Broke. Delightful.

Should we not better form a tangled union against the dogs that war against our bitter natures and hew our abjurations of solidarity that ill-advise to not harvest the turnips all about us as exampled by our courteous rodentine dwellers Mac and Tosh, noble lords of Nature, well-mannered terroirists against the scourge that is common democracy, the rabble-hole of yammering discontent? Quite simply, yes indeedy.

Those lads tingle my dingles.

I agree that Professor is a greater title than Doctor, but I must admit that I am tickled when in German-speaking countries I am addressed as "Frau Doktor." And, yes, staying married to one of these guys is an accomplishment.

Oh my, my, Lord Marmalade, you are the clever one, it's been ages since I watched Saturday morning cartoons. I especially liked the part where Archer D. Midland drives away with all the ve-ji-tuh-bles.

In the U.K., the proper title for a surgeon is Mr.

You want pretentious? Here's pretentious: if you go to, say, MIT and earn a doctorate in, say, Physics, then go to Germany to work, you can be arrested if you use the title "Dr.". No, really, it's true.

Marmalade --i find your writing in toxicating as well as elementary. Are you a drunken third grade teacher? I'll call you Dr. then.

Yes, Bucky, we know that story. Ian Baldwin, Ph. D., is originally from Baltimore.

How about an anti-pretension story (and one related to Artscape to boot) to quell the waters? Two years ago during Artscape it was sweltering, so we were looking for an inside bar. We wandered into Abercrombie, which was completely empty (I think it was mid-afternoon - maybe 3?).

We were in very casual attire (shorts as I remember), but the bartender made us feel more than welcome as we sat down for cold beverages at the bar (which I think only had 4-5 seats). They knew we weren't ordering food, but the chef sent out an amuse-bouche anyway. Very classy - which is the term I would like to give nice/fancy places that can pull it off without being pretentious.

I think the ownership/chef has changed since that time, but I'd like to think that it is as classy as I remember.

Classy post from Michelle! More, please.

Sherry has it right. It is high pretention to make you pay at one window and then drive to the second window for pick-up!

Back to the Chef business: I think pretention begins to set in when the server refers to the chef as "chef" witheout the "the" and then putting everything he does in the future tense "Chef will be making his signature peach sorbet". I've yet to hear "Dentist will be cleaning your teeth now."

ruth--credit where credit is due. That remark was made by RayRay, not Sherry.
I'm still laughing.

The best part about this conversation is that no one has a clue how to use the word correctly. Using it to describe a restaurant does nothing. There is always a more appropriate word to describe the types of things that have been pointed out as being "pretentious"

The best part about this conversation is people who assert that others are using words incorrectly, but who don't offer insight into what is correct.

BJ, we could use a man/woman like you in Washington.

Good point Bill in C,

They clearly don't know what chef means. I like when people call someone a reverend rather than a minister.

I remember flying to San Francisco 15 years ago on a particularly brutal flight which made me punch-drunk goofy tired. I went to the restaurant in my hotel, the nice one on top of the hill, the Mark Hopkins. I sat down in the restaurant, a nice one but not top end. The waitress came over and rattled off the most pretentious California description of some dish that I just burst out laughing. I made her repeat it at least once just because it was so funny.

It went something like this "Our special tonight is a blah-blah in a yogurt-based remoulade etc etc. I wish I could remember more, because it was ridiculous for the dish. Way too much flowery description.

Pretentious is when the "smoke and mirrors" become the center of attention. An elegantly served meal crys out for help when the presentation strays to the absurd. I pile in the middle of the plate comes to mind rather than to build the plate so that each portion is shown and individually displayed.

Comparing food to dentistry misses the point.

This Baltimore diatribe against "pretension" really just sounds like a fear of complex cuisine. It's like right-wingers complaining about immigrants, or people who speak english as a second language.

Beautifully presented and well-described food is not necessarily pretentious. A $20 salad is. Any restaurant that serves Fois Gras is DEFINITELY pretentious. A restaurant that has a chef is not pretentious any more than a company that has a CEO.

The biggest pretension in this town? Restaurants that never change that offer some faux or manufactured Baltimore flair- that's pretension. Cafe Hon egg salad??!??

Bo Brooks Seafood Restaurant is pretentious- because it's overpriced, and has an some Baltimore aura or mystique around it of being a "great little seafood place on the waterfront", so the place can do whatever the hell they want- including overcharging for their bland fish dishes. Same thing with Obryckis; "Let's go eat crabs in a building with no windows that looks like a grain silo, because generations of Baltimoreans that don't know any better think the "imported-from-Singapore-since-we-killed-the-Chesapeake crabs" are the best thing they ever ate. That's pretentious and ignorant. I have no problem with the small, new restaurant offering delightful, pretty, healthy, organic meals with fancy aiolis and remoulades. Just because you give customers good olive oil instead of butter for your bread does not mean pretentious.

It's the mainstays that are in this town that refuse to improve and change that are truly pretentious.

To review:

pretentious – expressive of affected, unwarranted, or exaggerated importance, worth, or stature

SnizzleSnazzle, your comment is a bridge under troubled waters.

I was at Vine in towson right when they opened and the waiter got a huge attitude and walked away when he thought I wasn't listening to the specials. I was actually straining to hear them and pointing my ear in his direction.

Bottled or Tap? This question is pretentious. a bad amuse bouche (a little appetizer from the chef) presented as if it was the greatest gift (at a pretentious fells point resto not to be named). $26.00 for a puny seafood stew with two shrimp (ah but they were handgrown) at a not to be named local resto. When ingredients are listed, especially if they are local and healthy, I like that, don't find that pretentious rather showing care in choosing local vendors instead of big corporate suppliers - should be more of that in Baltimore - locavore food.

Kimberly Ph.D.

I'll let you guys take this one...

Why not name the restaurant Kimberly? Imagine if Elizabeth reviewed unnamed restaurants.

Baltimore Pho in Hollins Market wants everyone to know it's "fuh" not "fo". They note this on their Web site and on their menu--I believe. And I had a 20-minute conversation w/ the waiter to order a recognizable dish. Recognizable as in a dish from a typical Vietnamese restaurant that does not make a special effort to teach you how to pronounce pho. Hell, just give me a big bowl of soup with lots of stuff in it then ...

How about the MANY places that insist on calling the "imported-from-Singapore-since-we-killed-the-Chesapeake crabs" Crabcakes "MARKET PRICE."

Maybe my #1 restaurant pet peeve.

How about simply picking a price that you can live with despite what is defended as 'market fluctuations?'

Crab prices are highly volatile. Don't believe me? I just posted a graph showing the producer price index for crabs by month from 1992 to 2009.

http://baltimorecrabs.wordpress.com

As you can see, prices can jump by more than 100% in a couple of months. I'm no fan of "market price" either and I think they do that for some products just so you don't get sticker shock but crab has crazy variaince from month to month.

Ha! Owl Meat's crab blog. Who would have thought it would be useful. Life is funny like that.

Thanks for the info, and excited to know about the blog.

But I maintain you can still find an acceptable price to cover that, especially since you rarely see the retail price rise or fall 100% in tandem with wholesale.

The smart and/or high-end places that have seasonal, changing or paper-printed menus can do this easily.

The others should find a price they can live with, get a buck or two more or less profit - say if it's $12.95 , it guarantees whatever margin to the upside, more profit if price drops

I'm pretty sure my #1 favorite Faidley's keeps the same price.

Other food commodity prices also fluctuate, as does gas, shipping and delivery price, yet other menu items have consistent prices.

I'm pretty sure my #1 favorite Faidley's keeps the same price.

That's a two-edged sword. When lobster prices were down everywhere else awhile back, Faidley's still charged their regular high price.

you rarely see the retail price rise or fall 100% in tandem with wholesale.

No doubt wholesale prices aren't directly related to menu prices. I suspect the following price voodoo goes on. (This is what I would do). If you have a printed price for a seasonally variable product like crab.
1) I would price it to be ridiculously profitable when supplied are cheap and plentiful.
2) If it double in price that would be my break even point. Chances are demand will be less out of season.
3) If it gets too expensive for a few weeks you would just be out of it for a while.
4) Reduce portion size when the wholesale price goes up.

The real economic voodoo happens when a restaurant can print a new menu and supposedly respond to market prices. Once the estaurant establishes what price people will pay they will never ever ever lower their prices.

In other words, you're screwed either way if the restauranteur is smart.

this city plain sucks because dixon is the mayor

Well, T@Y, that's a non sequitur even for this blog.

Mayor Dixon is responsible for crab prices?

I guess this is one reason I'm happy I don't live up there anymore. Baltimore will always be home to me but I don't miss all the sniggling over crab quality and prices.

When I'm in town and want a crabcake, I'll just go to Koco's and plunk down whatever they are asking for their crabcake platter. I know if I go there, I won't be disappointed and since I don't live in Baltimore anymore, I consider it a treat.
A treat indeed, to be back in Baltimore, in a neighborhood bar/restaurant and enjoying the quintessential food of the Land of Pleasant Living.

As you can see from this chart Maryland crab harvests are dying. Virginia's are healthy but ours are trending toward extinct. It's pathetic.

http://baltimorecrabs.wordpress.com/2009/07/13/maryland-and-virginia-blue-crab-harvest-1945-2007/

Maryland crab harvests have declined by 50 percent in the last ten years. Wake up people, you are destroying your crop at a heroic rate. Go ahead and look at the data and tell me otherwise. Virginia's harvests are consistent for the last sixty years.

Although I'm sure Virginia is reporting a healthy harvest, Owl, it is all lies. They have not enforced one measure to try to save the crab population, and if anything they are more reponsible for the over-fishing phenom than Maryland is. They've also enacted 0 legislation to keep farm waters from polluting the bay.

Although I think O'Malley could actually do more to protect the local crab population, without Virginia buying into it, it's a pretty worthless endeavor!

The crab population is a classic example of the tragedy of the commons.

I'm not so sure about that, RoCK. It could just as easily be read as a classic example of how the free market screws everyone to the benefit of a few (not the watermen, the folks like Phillips).

I don't think we can blame the O's performance on the crabs, though.

Well, without property rights, the free market will fall into a tragedy of the commons.

The difficult thing with the bay is how to handle the situation. Property ownership can sometimes be established in a common resource. We see this in oyster farms. The problem is when you start having migratory resources, such as crabs. Establishing ownership of a resource becomes far more difficult. I would say...wait for it...there is a place for government regulation or management of the resource (crabs) in this case.

I'm freakin' dumbfounded.

I have to agree with RoCK - at least this time...:)

Part of the problem with the "tragedy of the commons" problem is that if there are any property rights, some will take advantage. We haven't really had a good test of any alternatives (a few years in the middle of the Spanish Civil War, while interesting, was not exactly a real world test).

There are times when the size of the government is a useful thing. May the bay crabs go to the size of the federal government .

I think you are looping around to my part of the nuthouse, RoCK . Next up, how I'm in favour of gun ownership?

Have I entered some kind of weird alternate universe?

You're opposed to informed intelligent conversation Mr.Bucky?

Some fundamentalists would say you are speaking blasphemy ROCK and Lissa. All natural resources are given by God for Man to use and Man cannot ascend to Heaven until his plate is clean. Eat up. Crabs, it's what's for dinner

Not opposed. Just surprised when the two people who represent the right and left horizons of my Facebook friend list begin agreeing so frequently.

Frankly, I think it says something very positive about Chicken Rico's lunch menu.

Consider the case of Easter Island. Once a thriving robst society with enough resources and free time to carve gant heads. Think of the person who said Hey I think I'll cut down that last palm tree.

The tragedy of the commons sounds like anti-game theory or maybe not

Chicken Rico isn't the kind of place that has a separate lunch menu, Bucky.

RoCK and I have always agreed on some stuff. As he's pointed out before, we both wrap around the other side a bit.

Besides, I hate living up to other's expectations.

If I really wanted hate mail, I'd go in to how I'm against gay marriage (because I don't think the government should be involved in any marriage at all - it is a religious matter).

The free market solves everything. Survival of the fittest I say! You're thinking like pinko babies. Remember it's not just individuals competing with each other but groups. Enlightened self interest resolves all issues. The tragedy of the common assumes an unenlightened population. Note that the paper was written in 1968 the peak of the govt nanny generation. Take your medicine babies. Enlighten yourself and the market works fine. Modern free market thinking assumes a democratic context which is falacious. Democracy is antithetical to a truly free market.

Lissa,
I looked for you at Artscape on Saturday, but I missed you by 20 minutes.
I went to Chicken Rico on Sunday and the place was packed. I was too hungry to wait but the place smelled wonderful. What I saw on the other diners plates looked good. I'll definitely stop back in soon.

crab prices are a function of the stupidity of the mayor of a particular area. smart mayor = good bad mayor = complete lawlessness and this thing we call baltimore..

now if i can only type this "j" in the filed below I will be good

make that "field" below.....also, I really think worst tv sitcom of all time is Little Wonder with that stupid robot but I think that is for another blog here goes putting an "h" in the field below....

Just for you, Ronnie's ghost:
"Gracefully surrender the things of youth: birds, clean air, tuna, Taiwan..."

t@y, what are you talking about? That's just racist. How can you compare our mayor to a crab? Hasn't she been persecuted enough? LEave Shiela alone!

Sorry I missed you, RayRay, but after 4 hours of table working, I ran out quickly both days .

Chicken Rico is usually busy, especially early. Definitely worth another trip there. On a Sunday, after 2 or so is usually good.

Is it okay to still post about prententious restaurants?

Red Maple gets my vote. We went there a couple of summers ago with another couple, and at the time, Red Maple had just gotten some great reviews, which made getting a reservation pretty difficult. The best I could do for us on short notice was a Friday night reso at 9:30pm, and yes, even my night owl husband was grumbling about the late dinner.

When we arrived, they were charging a $10 cover charge. I explained that we were there for dinner, and the doorman said that he didn'e care what we were there for, that we needed to pony up $10 each or we were not getting inside. So, $40 spent and we haven't even sat at our table. Speaking of tables, I am sorry, I am a relatively young and bendy person, but there is absolutely no elegant way to eat dinner at a freaking cocktail table, the type of table at which we were seated. The music absolutely pounded, since at this point in the evening Red Maple was definitely more of a club than a restaurant. The food was not great, and tried to sell itself as tapas that could be eaten off of a cocktail table with only the aid of a fork, a spoon, and chopsticks. We were not provided any knives, and when we asked for knives were told that they were not necessary for our meal. Sorry, but in my book, slices of beef tenderloin are not tapas, and require a knife so that I don't choke on a 3" x 2" chunk of meat.

Of all the things that were horribly, and ostenatiously wrong with our evening, there were two things that were so bad that all four of us ended up in tears of laughter. 1st of all, remember the $10 cover? Well, that was apparently for the "live music" which, I swear to God, was a single drum in the middle of the floor that a guy would occasionally walk by and beat on. Once. He would beat on it once. Like every 15 minutes. And every time he did it, one of our dining companions would bellow, "Two dollars!" The second thing was the dessert. One of our party ordered a delicious sounding pomegranate cheesecake with a crust made of chocolate covered pretzels. Well, when this thing came out, the cheesecake part was a gelatinous mess, and the crust...oh, the crust. It was so hard that it was absolutely impossible to cut, especially with only the edge of a spoon since our forks had been taken away forever (the waiter completely disappeared for about 1/2 an hour), and you already know about the knives, or lack thereof. So, every time the diner tried to cut it with the side the spoon, he would have to use so much pressure that when he did break through, it would result in the loudest "CLANK" you have ever heard. The only thing that we could hear over the music, and thus,the only communication with each other we had for the past 2 hours of our meal. Tears, just tears of laughter were rolling down my face every time he sawed off another bite of this thing. Good lord, it was funny.

Anyway, Red Maple, for everything from beginning to end, was my most uncomfortable and most pretentious dining experience ever. It was obvious that we were uncomfortable, we asked the waiter several times to help us to rectify the situation before he disappeared altogether, and he made it clear that we were just fish out of water that didn't belong in a place where you should be able to eat filet mignon with chopsticks. However, the whole thing still makes me laugh, which may be worth the cover charge.

OMG I am sorry this is soooo long.

It's never too late to post on any entry. EL

And my 2nd vote still goes to Meli in Fells Point. Delicious dinner, nice service, all ruined because we were charged $15 for water that we did not ask for. And then when I called the next day to discuss it with a manager, was more or less made to feel uncouth for never having been charged for water before. I have eaten in some seriously nice, and seriously expensive restaurants in my life, and never, have I ever been charged for water in this way. Not just charged, but overcharged. They claimed that my dining companion and I polished off 4 1-liter bottles of water. In addition to cocktails and coffee. Yes, I am still floating.

enough...that what i say about your rant..."ENOUGH!" some of those gift cards were meant for the little crabs. and i wouldnt compare her to a crab unless it was a theiving crab...as for leaving her alone...I'll let the justice system handle that!!!!

Dawn -

you story was great. Red Maple is a clown show. Their stupid chef was on Top Chef and completely f'ing embarrassed herself and the restaurant. As for going to this hip hop new age eccletic uber hip bistro or whatever it is ..NO THANKS. the placed reeks of stupid people making bad food...as for the mayor being a crab..thta is just weird..though it may expain things..like not having a brain

Don't pick on former Red Maple chef Jill Snyder. It's a stupid TV show, not reality. She made an unfortunate choice on a game show. She's your neighbor; have a little compassion. She didn't turn out to be a TV star. Are you?

If you saw her audtion tape you would realize that she is a talented and charming person; I believe I used the winsome before. I was sad to see her stumble, since I had a litle crush on her.

Here's the video:
http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/entertainment/dining/reviews/blog/2008/11/post_111.html

As for Red Maple, the place always gave me a serious pretentious tool vibe just from the street.

I see Red Maple as being pretentious as well, but I would admit that I am more likely to see a place as being pretentious if I feel like an outsider there.

I'm not uber-hip (yes..it is true), so I'm not going to feel welcomed at a place like Red Maple.

I am WASPy and preppy (just a little), so I'm going to feel comfortable at place like the Prime Rib or Petit Louis.

Now maybe all three of these restaurants are pretentious, or maybe none of them are; however, I am more likely to perceive pretention when I'm on the outside as opposed to the inside.

That's an astute observation, RoCK, especially for a Republican. :-)

Now iss the time at Red Maple when we dance. Now touch my monkey

RoCK - Your words are definitely a good way to describe how I felt at Red Maple, and I am very much like you in that I am an original prep from Towson, much more at ease at Woodberry Kitchen, or even Birches for that matter (don't flog me...or touch my monkey!).

But, I guess that in my mind, a huge factor in being deemed pretentious is that you make your patrons feel as if they don't belong, or as if the restaurant is too good for them. It is my belief that all restaurants, as businesses, should make all those that visit feel as if they are welcome there (as long as they are dressed and within the guidelines and "ack rite") and are valued customers. That was not the vibe I got from Red Maple.

Oh, and one last qualifier for why Red Maple is so pretentious to me...we passed the place at least 5 times before we even found it thanks to their lack of WORDED sign. Yes, their sign is simply a small illuminated red tree on the side of the building. And a huge $10 charging doorman was standing in front of it. I shoulda known....

re: Red Maple

At the risk of nominating myself for pretentiousness, I was at Red Maple opening weekend, and have been quite a few times since, being a Mt. Vernon resident.

Their standards have definitely fallen over the years, partly because of the present economy. But moreover, having struggled to find a market niche in this city, I'm not surprised they've had to go so far afield to reinvent themselves.

I've had wonderful food in the past, not so much that past couple of times I've been.

It's a beautiful space, and wonderful concept that other cities support quite readily.

I find it telling that posters find Maple 'pretentious'. Manhattan can support a Red Maple on every block -- why can't Baltimore just have one? Does every establishment need to be the same?

Generalissimo, havent you been reading this forum? There is so much ignorance in Baltimore.
"Why cant I wear my Cole Haan in a restaurant"
"Why should I care where my food comes from"
"Whats the big deal about convection ovens"
"I just want a cup of Sanka, forget coffee shops"
"Why should I call anyone by a professional title"
"Bottled or tap is pretentious" -- this one deserves its own little comment because honestly, why is this not a valid question. Is it so absurd to think that someone would want to order sparkling water?

This is really why there are no Red Maples or really any good restaurants in Baltimore -- residents are just straight up /offended/ by them. Discuss.

Let me put it this way, it's not that Baltimore can't support a Red Maple.

It's that it forces a Red Maple (or prospective competitors) to become something radically different, in order to thrive.

And yes, the sandbox has gotten a great deal more crowded in recent months. But, for better or worse, it's definitely been offering a more complete cross-section of the city's demographics, tastes, and preferences.