How long does the average party occupy a table? I would think two hours would be plenty most of the time, but I guess it depends on the restaurant and the occasion.

The restaurant has every right to put a time limit on a table. However the restaurant should let people know ahead of time that there is a reservation at 8pm if the make a reservation at the same table at 6pm. It is not difficult, the restaurant just has to let everybody know what's going on.

In some cities, people who don't show up for their reservation get charged $25-$50 if they don't cancel an hour or so beforehand. Once again, I see no problem with that as long as the restaurant makes the person aware.

Tables are money, usually the bigger the party the more time alloted. If you really think about, people should take how much time they spent at the table into consideration when tipping. I know people won't agree with that one.

People who make a 8pm reservation should have their table at 8pm and restaurants should let the 6pm table know that there is a reservation for that particular table at 8pm.

I believe that the Wine Market got treated a little unfairly since the story is kind of one-sided.

If the restaurant asks a table to move to the bar it is customary that they buy the party a round of drinks, and if they don't drink possible dessert.

Might depend on the party at the table. Two hours is usually more than enough for me but I can see a larger party (friends or business) taking longer especially if it involves alcohol and desserts.
I had a business dinner somewhere in Ottawa and we were there for a long time and thought the check must have came while I was away from the table, instead later the waiter came to the table to take our dessert order. I guess it is common in Europe and other places to expect people to use the table all night. Usually I have better things to do.

As a former frequent OC visitor during summer, I think I can answer that question, Dahlink. The answer is way too long! While others are huddled around the front entrance waiting for someone to leave so they can be seated there they are. Not everyone, but enough to be a pain. The sip coffee chat and never leave people! The ones that I feel like going up to and saying "would you please pay your damn check and get the hell out so someone else can eat?" people.

I'm cranky when I'm hungry and waiting in line! :)

Taking reservations is part art and part science. From what I have read about the exchange between the guest and our host we could have handled the situation better. However, readers should understand that the host informed the guest that we had one table left and that it was booked at 8 pm. So, essentially we gave them the option to take the table with a 2 hour seating time or to make arrangements elsewhere if they thought that was too short a time frame. No one asked them to leave at the end of the meal. I believe our staff member was trying to make sure we honored our commitment to the 8 pm table. We are a small restaurant with a limited amount of tables. That being said, the hostess should have simply taken the 4 at 6 pm and kept her other thoughts to herself. If we ran behind we could have switched some things around and been able to get all of the 8 pm reservations down on time. We do not make it a practice of unnecessarily bothering our guests with the knowledge of what time the next wave of tables are coming in. We will certainly review this incident with all front of the house staff.
Chris Spann
Owner
The Wine Market

I would prefer this to being seated and then rushed (or told to move to the bar.) It gives me the choice...if I think we will be longer than two hours, I'd say, "Thanks, but that won't be acceptable to us; we'll try someplace else." If it works for me, I'd take the reservation, knowing the clock was ticking.

(Now, I would be pissed if I got there at 6:00, waited until 6:45 to be seated and they STILL wanted their table back at 8:00.)

The Wine Market did precisely what a responsible restaurant should. It was clearly prepared to relinquish a 6:00 PM reservation by Sam's correspondent rather than inconvenience someone with an 8:00 PM reservation. That's a lot better than what I suspect all of us have at some point experienced. Showing up on time for a reservation, being ushered to the bar and waiting far too long for our name to be called or some electronic doohickey to vibrate.

Joyce W wrote: "I'm cranky when I'm hungry and waiting in line! :)"

Which brings another dimension to the problem - the restaurant that does not take reservations. You walk in, are told about how long the wait might be and are given a pager. Its not a question of someone having the table reserved two hours later, it having someone waiting for the table NOW.

I keep running into this problem at Hamilton Tavern when there is a wait for a table. I feel rushed knowing that other people are waiting for my table, but at the same time I should be able to eat in peace.

I understand it's unpleasant to have the sort of "magic" of eating at a restaurant -- of being served and waited upon -- to be ruined with practicalities like the reality of when the next table is coming in. I really do. But at the same time, when I make a reservation, I want to know for sure it will be ready when I get there. It's a trade-off. I think, in theory, both sides here are correct. I bet most of us have no idea how often restaurants gamble by taking our reservations when they know it's a race to the wire before they need the table again. It's the transparency of the hostess admitting it that ruined things in this case. There has to be a certain amount of opacity in the restaurant business to preserve the feeling of being a guest, of being waited-upon. When I was a server, I spent many a nail-biting evening praying everyone would clear out when they needed to. And generally, they do. There's usually no need to warn people. The hostess should have kept her worries to herself.

A couple of years ago the wife and I had a ten course meal at the Langham in Boston. I'm thinking it took around four hours.

Now, putting aside the rare ten course meal, I still find alot of the meals we have push the two hour limit, what with a cocktails and couple of courses. I would imagine the problem most restaurants have is when diners linger over repeated refills of coffee, as oppossed to those whose dessert or after dinner drink pushes past the time of the next reservation.

Hats off to Chris Spann of the Wine Market for his reasoned response!

The art & science of restaurant reservations:
http://www.helensgarden.com/V2/reservations/

they sure have their panties in a knot over there at midnight sun. what is the problem with setting the expectation of time from the get-go? how self absorbed do you need to be to not be able to acknowledge that yes, a restaurant needs more than just your table, and yes, there are other diners coming after you. the person calling was given the info at the time of booking. what else do you need?

...people should take how much time they spent at the table into consideration when tipping...

We refer to this as "Buying the table"

I was a server for a long time, so I know the ins and outs of table turnover.

As far as the amount of time it takes to eat: I regularly get alcoholic drinks (more than one), appetizers (more than one for the table), entree, and sometimes dessert.

Now, if the food comes out the way it is supposed to (by that I mean, appetizers, then you are given enough time to eat it before the entree comes out) it takes a good hour plus for us to eat. And the specific experiences coming to mind are Friday's/Outback kind of places-def not anything fancy.

This is because we usually order water, decide what drinks we are going to get. When the water comes, we give the drink order. When they come we give the appetizer order, when that comes we give the entree order. I WILL NOT order my appetizer and entree at the same time. I hate, more than anything, having my appetizer come with my food. More and more servers are unable to time the food coming out.

So, if I'm going out and spending REAL money on a dinner, I will probably spend 2+ hours there. And no, I will not make the reservation if there's going to be a time limit on my meal.

Carey makes some good points about server errors. I hate when I'm still eating my appetizer and my food is plunked in front of me too. And, another point we haven't discussed, is a lot of times, the server makes the table time longer all by themselves because they completely dissapear when you are trying to find them to get your check. I'd like to say this only happens at chain/bar kind of places but it's happened at upscale places many times too.

WOW, as the person who raised the topic, I will offer some clarification.

First, I love the Wine Market and I love that they take reservations. This is perhaps why I was disappointed with being given a time limit - this was a dinner with the in-laws as part of their Christmas gift, and we wanted to make it special. I also find that if we take time to review the wine list (this is the Wine Market, after all), order apps, entrees, coffee/after dinner drinks/dessert - or more likely order that second bottle of wine and want to finish off the remains before getting up - we're going to push up on the 2 hour mark. If it had been presented as a "we're booked but I can give you a table at 6" situation, I would have thought the offer generous. We actually wanted a 6:00 reservation, not like we were looking for 7 and they offered 6 as a compromise.

Of course I have been on the other end and it's so annoying to have an 8 p.m. reservation and have to wait, I just found it odd that MY TABLE was reserved at 8. I'm not an idiot; I know that there will be people who are not seeking an early-bird style eating time such as 6 p.m. and that I should not expect to sit down at 6 and stay until 11. But it's not like we were going to watch a football game and there was really a reason to worry about us lingering; our name, as far as I know, is not a synonym for squatter. I've waited tables, I know what it's like to have people just sit and stew and not even want a refill on their coffee.

And finally, I WILL go back to the Wine Market - I actually didn't know that their name would be used in the post, otherwise I would have kept my inital inquiry anonymous - I didn't want to single them out.

Reasoned response from AC-M (who started the whole discussion) also--could it be that general civility is about to break out all over?

Dahlink,
I sure hope so, its about time!

I liked the Wine Market's owner's response too.

My experience at Hamilton Tavern raised a similar issue--we (a fourtop) waited about an hour for a table and ate reasonably quickly (we were hungry!). When we were about to order another round of drinks after dinner, our waiter told us that we needed to vacate the table because others were waiting. Some at our table felt this was appropriate because the place was crowded with folks waiting for tables; others thought that it was rude of the waiter. It seems like this discussion also shows the same split in views--whether to show consideration for the diners or for those waiting.for tables.

It seems to me there was a big issue about being rushed from tables with Tio Pepes a few years back...I don't know what ever became of that or if it was a real or perceived problem.

It is a very important subject. But, there are rules for everything, We allow a couple for two hours dining in a very busy night, and if we can we let them enjoy the rest of the evening, A four top party about 2.5 hours, and above that 3 hours. I do agree that the relationship is mutual, once the rules are spoken out, then eveyone agrees to them. Many restaurant have limited seating and they have to turn these table in order to meet the financial goal, not due to greed, but to cover their expenses, make a profit and stay open.I also agree that many diners don't know what it takes to operate a restaurant. Perhaps a list of complaints from the owners side can be posted here just to educate diners about a typical Saturday night, and what is involved.
1- People don't show up.
2- People don't call to cancel
3- People come with more persons that the reservation calls for without a warning.
4-People don't respect the local dress code or policy, many think if they spend money at your place, they own you.
5-People make mistakes when ordering and blame it on the server, just because the next table dish looks better, now they want that.
6-People walk out without paying.
7-People insult servers, they think these people are beneath them.
9-People get a ticket for parking wrong, and blame the restaurant.
10-People steal silverware,Salt&pepper shakers, and china.
But of course there is the other breed, who love to go out and have a good time, understanding the rules, and the essence of a guest and a host.

Michael Tabrizi--thanks for offering another perspective. I am confident that there is a special circle in hell for people who mistreat their servers, blow off their reservations or steal from the table! Do you keep tabs on the bad apples?

I remember, from when I was a server in Little Italy, how extremely rare it was for someone to call to cancel a reservation. Generally, they just wouldn't show up -- even parties as large as 10 people. At a small restaurant, this devastates a server's evening. Typically, to ensure the best service, one server would be assigned only to that table all evening. When the table doesn't show up, the server goes home empty-handed. I ALWAYS call ahead to cancel, leaving plenty of time, and I always get a surprised reaction from the hostess/host: "Wow ... you called ahead to cancel ... We SO appreciate that!"

This disclaimer/warningrequest is from Aldo's Restaurant Week online menu:

Due to the high volume of guests served during Restaurant Week, we respectfully request, in consideration of other guests, that you please limit your seating time to 1 hour, 30 minutes

Even so, the menu looks wonderful. I really have to find someone to come to Aldo's with me. Restaurant Week is certainly the only way I can afford it.

Eve, I would think that the imposition of such a disclaimer/warning/request means that I wouldn't have to wait ten minutes after being seated for the server to come and ask me about drinks, ten minutes to get said drinks and place the food order, ten to fifteen minutres for the kitchen to prepare the appetizer and the server to deliver it, and fifteen minutes (or more) for the entree, not counting the dessert/coffee. If it takes an hour to get to the entree, please don't expect me to wolf down my food in order to be finished on time. And yes, there have been times at other restaurants (I have never been to Aldo's), especially when it was busy, that I have waited an hour before the entrees came. I am willing to uphold my part of the bargain if the restaurant is willing to live up to theirs.

I know I'm late to these postings but if people call for reservations and I have a table for a limited time (say 1 1/2 hours), I offer it with that disclaimer so THEY can decide if they want to come in with that sort of time constraint established. Usually, the person I am talking to is calling at the last minute and I am trying to accomodate them. I didn't realize this may be offensive. Was there a consensus reached? Yeah, I know, consensus is not in the cards but... a girl can hope.

Although some folks were really upset that they might get limited, I think the consensus was that as long as a restaurant was up front about a time limit and the service wasn't snail paced, it wasn't exactly offensive.

As you said, with the information up front, people can decide.