The best place to go for the office holiday party is home, early. These are co-workers, not family and friends, so forced celebration is inappropriate, at best.

Add that not everyone is Christian, and you are pushing me into rant territory. I don't ask anyone to acknowledge or celebrate my holidays, don't ask me to celebrate yours. Especially at work.

My office always goes to Morton's The Steakhouse for our holiday lunch party. The food is great, and many of us don't get a chance to go there any other time of the year.

There are merry places? Cool. I've always wanted to try merry. How come Christmas stole merry? Once we rid the world of Comcast Katie, FreeCreditReport.Com dude and whoever came up with duodenal-pub we should take back merry.

Chuck E. Cheese is festive.

Amicci's bar still has last year's Christmas lights up. Is that festive?

There's a certain kind of festive that would make me murderous - the place where 8 servers sing a kooky birthday song at you. Zany! Festive? Hmmm...

I know we had a discussion of "mmm..." some time back. I read that the apathetic expression "meh" has been added to the dictionary. Again Homer Simpson was cited as a prominent user of the expression. As in donuts - Mmm....., Wheat Thins - meh.

Geez. Many of my co-workers are good friends. You sound a bit grumpy.

I agree with Lissa completely. Work friends are like bar friends, i.e., situational acquaintances. Office parties are not parties. They are like anti-parties. Just like in politics, at the office you only allowed to be Christian or Jewish. Boo to office parties.

There are two good things about office parties. First you get to see the awesome Christmas sweaters that some people need to wear. Need to wear. And the possiblity that someone will get drunk and do an Elaine dance or make out with a co-worked in the Xerox room. Or something else inappropriate.

Bah Humbug

I fine reason for picking someones pocket ever twenty fifth of December

Minimize the eschaton

Office holiday parties aren't bad because they're holiday parties as much as they're bad because they're office parties.

Minimize the eschaton

A provocative statement.

Welcome. You should give yourself a name.

I think we can agree the office party is an oxymoron, like Australian cuisine.

I revise my earlier opinion ("sound a bit grumpy"). You folks are all grumps.

Minimize the eschaton

I can't tell if that's a joke, or if a spell checker garbled "immanentize". Or Jack's Bistro.

Some of us are uber-grumps.

Grumps?

I think we are just a discerning group, that's all.

Festive: anyplace where the diners at neighboring tables will join in, and applaud, for a verse of "Happy Birthday" -- so Sabatino's (and other Little Italy joints); Arcos, the Prime Rib (okay, maybe they won't sing along, there), the Dizz. Jack's Bistro.

And, Hey! I like our office parties (in my mind I'm always attending a secular "Wintertime festival activity that Americans call Christmas.")

This year we're all of us from the office going to the Waterfront for lunch. Don't want to overplug here, but I appreciated how "ready" they seemed for big parties. Fireplaces, too. We're looking forward.

I'm an introvert. Sometimes, I'm also grumpy. But, introversion is more accurate in this context.

Irregardless, "work" and "party" are not two great things that taste great together. I also object to public displays of religion (especially on government property).

I saw a t-shirt I think I'll get for my DW:

Sometimes I Wake Up Grumpy.
Other Times I Let Him Sleep.

(Yes, I had a figurine of the scowly-faced Dwarf on my desk at work - when I was still working)

Now, Lissa, I'm not having it. You're sitting right next to me, and we're going to do that "I'm crushing your head" thing from "Kids in the Hall" to all of our co-workers.

I'm introverted too, Lissa. I hate anything "social" that's work related. I like my co-workers fine. I just don't want to party with 'em - and I especially don't want to party with their significant others that I've never met before and will never see again.

Also, I fail to understand where we have separation of church and state in this country, when people are basing their religous beliefs on the way that they cast their votes. Just ranting.

Joyce W - not to get into a big thing, but as to religion, the 1st Amendment restricts the government, not the governed.

Specifically, it says, " Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..."

People are free to consider religious views (along with everything else) when deciding for whom they wish to vote.

I feel deliciously evil, a la Montgomery Burns, at the thought of a separation of church and state discussion. Since I'm sure we're all too considerate to get into it here, I'll have to find someone to pick a fight with. mwahahahha (Though most of the people in my life are really smart and realize that religion belongs nowhere near government. I'll have to look extra hard.)

the free exercise thereof...

No one is free at work. You should leave all your personal stuff at home, including religion.

As usual, comments quickly spin off into nonsense on here. The first poster grumped about anyone having holiday parties with co-workers, and now it's degenerated into church-state blather. Folks, are you so constricted that you don't want to have a nice dinner/party at a "special" time of the year (notice I was careful not to mention any particular offensive event) with people you happen to know, and maybe even like (let alone their disgusting S/O's)? Wow.

Ahh, it is impossible to remove religion from politics and from the culture as well. Anyone who suggests otherwise is deluding themselves as to human nature.

Now, I'm not going to force others to celebrate my holidays; however, I will say that my holidays are more fun.

I celebrate, or "observe" as Jon Stewart would say, the Jewish Holidays with my wife. These days involve fasting, or eating burnt lamb and cold fish loaf, or being reminded about all the bad things that have ever happened. Oy!

Now, let's look at the holidays my wife gets to celebrate with me. I'm able to offer Santa and the Easter Bunny, gifts and candy, and multiple reasons to eat ham. I mean come on...ham.

OldPhil is obviously an extrovert, and a rather intolerant one at that. Its amazing how many extroverts don't understand us introverts at all. Just because OldPhil thinks office parties are fun doesn't mean it's fair for him to assume that everyone else is just like him.

Lissa and Joyce, I'd suggest we form an Introvert's Club, but no one would show up for the meetings.

OldPhil, it must be nice living in your candy-colored world. I like that "nice" and "special" are the axioms of your argument. If everything is nice and special, then it would be irrational to not like a nice and special event. I get to decide for myself what is nice and/or special.

I wish there was an elf here to kick.

Without our "blathering" ths post would be empty of comments. Did you notice that there was not one suggestion for a festive place? Most unmerry indeed.

The separation of church and state is very real issue here now. George Bush said that God told him to invade Iraq. The Bush government has been funnelling tons of tax money to churches for total bulls**t "faith-based" social and health programs, such as faith-based drug rehab programs run by completely unqualified church people. As in, if you believe in Jesus your drug addiction will go away. Your tax dollars at work. Courts mandate AA attendance for drunk drivers, where they insist that you surrender yourself to a "higher power", which is just code for a judeo-christian deity. Living in a Judeo-Christian society is oppressive in many small ways, especially at this "special" time of year.

We like to blather and you telling us to shut our pie holes just makes us more hornery.

RoCK, your ham argument is the most compelling one I've heard. Who can argue with ham? You throw bacon in there and I'll celebrate any holiday. I'm looking forward to helping Bourbon Girl pick out a Christmas tree and decorate it. I have no interest in Christmas, but I like her, so I'll be fine and possibly dandy. That's my choice, but at work you have no choice if you want to be successful. Your success at work shouldn't have anything to do with religion, sexuality, politics or stamp collecting. It's economic terrorism at the personal level.

Ok, Gorelick, I'm a sucker for KitH. Don't think I could pull that off, though.

It is hard to discuss holiday food without religion coming up, this time of year. I know Native Americans who fast on Thanksgiving, because it is a day of mourning for them. One of the joys of living in a heavily Arab neighbourhood in Detroit was watching recent immigrants go totally, giddily over the top on typically American holidays, such as Thanksgiving and the 4th of July.

It wasn't clear, but one of the reasons I grump about holiday parties at work is because I work for a governmental entity. No, I wasn't happy with work parties when I worked in the corporate world, and, yes, I have co-workers I adore and socialize *outside* of work with, but I still think it is valid to object to forced celebration.

Is anyone really fooled by calling it a "holiday party"? It is still a Christmas party, and not everyone is Christian.

I've never thought of holiday office parties as religious affairs. When I had a small company in California, I used to spring for a holiday party every year. The idea was...hey, we work hard together, time to have some fun together. The only rule was that anything said or done after a snootful would be totally forgotten by the following work day. Okay, we were in the entertainment industry, mostly outgoing types. But the parties helped built the esprit that paid off when we were on deadline and under pressure.

form an Introvert's Club

Count me in Hal. We can meet separately and independently at the time of our own choosing.

and not everyone is Christian.

If you're not a Christian the only other valid choice in the workplace is Jewish. "None of the above" doesn't fly.

I love the term "forced celebration". I guess that would be under the authority of the Joy Division?

Trivia question: Why does the calendar start seven days AFTER Christmas? It would seem like the actual birthday would be a good starting point. (Yes, I know Dec 25 isn't the real birth date.)

No workplace I've ever been in "forced" anyone to attend a holiday party. My initial post was merely in reaction to the attitude that NO ONE should have 'em because someone might not like it. If you choose not to participate, just go home and have some fun on your own. But this atttude of no one else can have fun because I'll might be offended is really bizarre. Lighten up folks, it's almost that special elf-kicking time of the year!

Well,
Back to the subject at hand (sort of) when I worked at Alex. Brown, my department held their parties at Peter's Pour House on Water Street. Definitely an alcohol-soaked affair, but there was food too and they gave away the neatest prizes. I'm guessing Water Street is too '90s for today's crowd.
The company I currently work for has "Team Building Events" which is a thin disguise for a holiday party so its a tax write-off.
We've had some very swank parties in years past but the economy and actions of Prez Shrub and his merry band has pretty much squelched this year's soiree. I liked the paid flight home to visit a couple weeks before I flew up to celebrate with my fiancee and family.

Hal, we could meet online. Online is an awesome place for introverts. I can script myself, even.

My dear Owl, I must disagree about your characterization of AA's Higher Power being simply disguised Judeo-Christian religion. In some meetings, it is. But, that was not the intent of the founders, nor is it that way everywhere. In many meetings, a Higher Power is just that - anything more powerful than that person. And each individual gets to choose.

In the case of an alcoholic, probably just about anything is more powerful than them by the time they end up at an AA meeting.

I'm of two minds about mandated AA meetings, but I am adamantly against the Courts sending people to Church-run homeless shelters, detoxes, rehab centres, etc. Double hatred if my tax dollars are supporting them. Religion wants to be free.

Folks, sorry I stirred up such a hornet's nest here with my nasty "holiday" party views. I'll refrain from any more offending posts on this issue. Wouldn't want to further disturb the matrix. Grumble bells, grumble bells, grumble all the way....

Be a mensch, Phil, and argue intelligently! No need to pick up your sandbox and run away.

As for "no one is forced...", when the person who signs your paycheck or your supervisor says, "The holiday party is Tues. at 12 pm in the Torture Room, everyone is expected to bring a dish to pass and please don't spend more than $10 a person on gifts", how is this not forcing?

Bonding on someone else's non-negotiated terms is not pleasant for everyone.

In my office, a few co-workers chose not to attend the holiday party for a variety of reasons. No one thought less of them for it, so what's the fuss? Go if you want to, don't go if you don't want to.

No workplace I've ever been in "forced" anyone to attend a holiday party.

Maybe not explicitly, but repeated non-attendance to company social events can brand one as "not a team player", which is a common business euphemism for "had the audacity to say no".

Ah, you drew me back in for a sec. Maybe you've worked in some onerous sweatshops, but I've been blessed (can I say that?) to have had reasonable bosses and friendly co-workers who sincerely enjoyed each other's company at work and play. Sorry if that offends the grumps here. See ya all later.

And, of course, if you aren't a team player, you are first in line for layoffs and last in line for raises.

I think the problems with holiday office parties is they have taken all the fun out of them. There was a time when office parties were centered around scotch and soda. Now the parties are centered around soda, no doubt ones that are diet and caffine free.

An introverts club on-line works fine for me. Attend when you feel like it....Hey, isn't that kinda like...D@L?

I HATE the team player thing. It's just one more of that corporate drek like "take a meeting", "we'll talk off-line", and "on the same page". BARF!

Old Phil - don't leave. I'm starting to like you. We need some glass-half-full people here.

The problem with you Joyce is that you need to think outside the box. And push the envelope more.

OMG, you got to get your synergy on, and stop isolating Joyce. We can bring her onside. Perhaps if we pick something from the corporate catalog. Say a logo toothbrush?

I'm an introvert, too, but on the other hand, my office usually has a huge platter of oysters at the holiday party. I have my price!

"Irregardless" Hmmmmm. Surprised someone didn't jump on that one.

I for one think it is time for this conversation to undergo a paradigm shift to something more proactive.

We need some glass-half-full people here.

To the optimist the glass is half full.
To the pessimist the glass is half empty.
To the engineer the glass is twice as large as it has to be.

Almost time to get out my Christmas t-shirts and ties, some of which my DW won't let me wear out in public.

Owl & Lissa, good corpo-babble! You have been studying I see!

TQM babe.

Joyce, I can do corpo-babble with the best of them, but I'd rather not. It will be a lot funnier once I don't have to deal with it anymore.

Joyce, I was an ISO 9000 auditor when I worked for EDS.

I started paying attention to corporate jargon when I was on a conference call about 4 months after a merger, and the person running the meeting said, "We can move beyond synergy now."

My immediate reaction was, "You mean I can start ignoring everyone again? Cool!"

I'll be back...